User talk:Leneath

Welcome, Leneath!

Before we start, I would like to begin by welcoming you to Yu-G-Oh! Wiki! As a new user, you may want to learn a few things that will be useful in your contributions:

Getting started ☆Basic overview of wiki code ☆What Wikia is not ☆Uses of a wiki Common Categories ☆ Characters ☆ ☆ Other helpful links ☆Wanted Pages ☆ ☆

Helpful tips ☆A list of administrators that you can contact in case of a problem can be found here. ☆On talk pages, please sign your comments with four tildes (~~~~). ☆To upload images, please use Upload image/file. ☆If you would like to create a page for yourself that is not related to Yu-Gi-Oh!, please do so at User:Leneath/Name.

Thanks for contributing, and I hope you'll have a great time here! I look forward to working with you!!

Dmaster (Contribs • Count) 06:23, 22 July 2008 (UTC)

فارس vs. ساحر

Why do you insist on changing Dark Magician's Arabic name from (فارس الظلام) to (ساحر الظلام)? -- Melik el-Al'ab 12:46, 23 July 2008 (UTC)

A few pointers...

Since you're an active member and constant contributor of Arabic names, I though I should give you a few pointers because I hope that we can work together.

1- Each time you add an Arabic name that you translated or made up, please add The Arabic name given is an approximation. above the card table .

2- If you wish to add a name to a card that already has an Arabic name, then you have 2 choices:
2a- If you want to add it as an alternate name, use the Names page of each card.
2b- If you want to replace the Arabic name in the table with your contributed name, please consult the contributor of the name on the card using their Talk Page or discuss the change in the Discussion page of each card.

I'll add more soon... salaam for now إلى اللقاء -- Melik el-Al'ab 14:02, 23 July 2008 (UTC)

Because of the Knight version of Dark Magician, which is called Dark Magician Knight. If we called the original Dark Magician a Knight, what will we call the other ? and i don't believe in the official name of the cards in the Arabic dub, since the card name change from time to time (in the dub), for example the card Pot of Greed. Anyway, i believe it's better to stick with the English card name from the Upper Deck release, specially since we don't have any Arabic releases yet.. Good luck. Update: thanks for the tips ^ ^. Leneath 14:21, 23 July 2008 (UTC)

Well, on the issue of Dark Magician, you have to consider why Dark Magician wasn't called a Magician in the dub in the first place. It's because of the negativeness of the term "Magician" in Arabic (as I have mentioned in Dark Magician's Names Page). From personal experience, I can guarantee that if an Arabic card game was released portraying the "hero" with the name (ساحر) it will receive high criticism especially from religious figures which may result in the banning of the game. (as what initially happened with Pokémon in Saudi Arabia, although that's another issue).

As for Dark Magician Knight, I suggest calling him "Dark Knight Swordsman" (فارس الظلام السيّاف) like how "Celtic Guardian" was changed to "Guardian Swordsman" (السيّاف الحارس) for lack of a better term.

As for following the dub's names, I have devised a system for it: If the name is alright, and there's no reason to not follow it, then we should consider it. If the name was NOT OK, like Dark Magician Girl the Dragon Knight's official name, we list it as a mistranslation, and add an approximated name of our own (keeping in mind censorship standards). As for cards with more than one name, we simply pick the better one, and list the other in the Names page. Preserving anime names increases the familiarity of them among the fandom, instead of having different names for the anime and card game. Of course, as I said, some official names are just plain stupid.

As for following Upper Deck's naming system, I am somewhat against it. Firstly, they tend to screw up a few times when they change the original Japanese names like what happened with the Archfiends and the Guardians. Second, you can't exactly translate English to Arabic word-for-word (I have had a tough time with this numerously). And third, English censorship of names is different than Arabic. Religious censorship is more strict in Arabic (that's why card's like "The Creator" and "Judgment Dragon" are changed to "The Creator of Illusions" and "Justice Dragon" to avoid religious references and offensiveness), while the violence censorship is less strict in Arabic (that's why "Mystic Tomato" can probably keep its Japanese name "Killer Tomato" with no problem).

So, when you're adding Approximated Arabic names, keep in mind the issues of archetypes, censorship, etc. And if you can't literally translate it, give it a close enough name of your own but make sure it's correct and creative! ;-) -- Melik el-Al'ab 18:43, 27 July 2008 (UTC)

I agree with using anime names over translations of English names. It's common policy to go with official terminology over translations. Arabic was actually the first language that doesn't exist in the OCG/TCG, that we allowed names for. This was because we knew it had official names from the anime.

But, as for avoiding reliogious connotation in approximating names for cards whose don't exist in Arabic, doesn't seem right. It's can be misleading and we don't often censor. Same case with English names. "Doomkaiser Dragon's" name is likely to be changed in English, but we still use the Japanese translation for now.

As for "Dark Magician Knight", it was in the anime... so doesn't it have an Arabic name from that? -- Deltaneos (talk) 19:00, 27 July 2008 (UTC)

Well, it is fairly reasonable that when giving an approximated name, we follow the same pattern as the official names, hence the same censorship standards for each language. It's not just a matter of language actually, it's also a matter of culture. And if a culture finds a card name offensive, then it should be changed. I personally find The Creator's name offensive if directly translated to Arabic (as I have mentioned here, that's why I changed it to "The Creator of Illusions". So, if you want to be lax on violence censorship or any other censorship then be my guest, but religious censorship should be placed where appropriate. It's just not right naming a card "Jesus Christ" for example. -- Melik el-Al'ab 19:15, 27 July 2008 (UTC)

Sorry for asking but when did Dark Magician Knight appear exactly? -- Melik el-Al'ab 19:19, 27 July 2008 (UTC)

Melik el-Al'ab, i see that you have a good point and i respect that. :) For the Dark Magician Knight card, i don't really know the exact time, but if you want to find out, check the release date of Reshef of Destruction Promos or/and GBA Doublepack Promos. Thanks for stopping by, come back anytime. :P Leneath 07:07, 28 July 2008 (UTC)