Forum:Reducing the size of this deck.

I just recently put together this deck with a friend this past weekend. I haven't played the game in about 6 years so I had him help me pick a lot of the more traditional cards. Though, I would greatly appreciate suggestions on what to put into my Extra Deck as I don't have any cards that can be put into it.

It's mostly DARK cards at the moment, and I'd like to keep it that way. Some suggestions on cards that manipulate DARK cards would be greatly appreciated as it has been a very long while and I have little to no idea what I'm doing here.

Also, I've got a few Ritual Cards in here, along with their respective Ritual Summoning cards, but these cards seem to have fallen out of favor (and for good reasons, it seems). So any advice on what to do with these would go a long way for me as well. (Whether it be to just get rid of them or to add some specific cards that would help, either would do great.)

As you can see, I am at the maximum amount of cards one can have in a deck and that's just way too many. I gotta get through so many cards to get what I want/need for what fits the situation that it just becomes ridiculous. Lost too many duels because of not being anywhere near the card I wanted.

I also have access to just about any type of purchasing (Ebay, Hobby Shops, etc) and price isn't that huge of an issue. So, if your guys have suggestions for what I should add (though I'd rather focus on getting rid of cards right now) getting those cards shouldn't be a problem.

Anyways, thank you for your time and I look forward to your response!

Ember113 (talk • contribs) 05:09, August 2, 2011 (UTC)

Dropping the Rituals is a good way to start. It's kinda hard to work with them if you're not dedicated to them. From there, I need to ask, do you want to stay set with something of a Red-Eyes Dragon deck, or a Dark World deck? That would make narrowing down the deck easier. 75.49.1.28 (talk) 05:15, August 2, 2011 (UTC)

If anything, I would want a Dark World deck. From the few Dark World cards I do have, the affects would do amazing things, especially in the times my opponent makes me discard cards. Ember113 (talk • contribs) 19:39, August 2, 2011 (UTC)

First and foremost. Take out the normal monsters. They may be more traditional, but they're in no way competitive. Dark Magician sucks outside of a Spellcaster deck, and Red-Eyes B. Dragon sucks outside of a Red-Eyes deck. Ritual Monsters (especially the DARK variety) can actually be made into a decent deck. The cards most helpful are probably among the Djinn of Rituals monsters, more specifically Djinn Disserere of Rituals, Djinn Cursenchanter of Rituals, and Djinn Releaser of Rituals. Ritual Raven, Sonic Bird, Senju of the Thousand Hands and Manju of the Ten Thousand Hands make for good support. Your best ritual monsters would probably be Demise, King of Armageddon, Dark Master - Zorc, and Garlandolf, King of Destruction. Contract with the Abyss is a spell card that can work on all three of them. Spells and traps are not my forte, but Fulfillment of the Contract can get your rituals out of the grave, Preparation of Rites can get you a Garlandolf, King of Destruction from your deck and a spell from your grave, which is beautiful when combined with Samsara, which adds the ritual material back to the deck, and Ritual Cage can help protect them some. Aside from that, Ritual Buster works like a Trap Stun. Throw in at most ONE less than the amount of copies of the ritual spell cards as you have the ritual monsters, and then three Contract with the Abyss, and you should be golden.

Gishki Chain is useful even without having ritual monsters in your deck. It allows you to rearrange your next three cards, puts a ritual spell in your hand if one is among them, and has an attack of 1800 to boot. Compulsory Evacuation Device is helpful if you need to reuse a monster's effect, such as Manju of the Ten Thousand Hands. The same can be said for Begone, Knave!, especially if you're using him to specifically get out Demise, King of Armageddon. It also helps against swarming, and can save you in a pinch. Last, but not least, Star Blast, which allows you to reduce the level of a monster on the field or in your hand by paying 500 lifepoints. Dragoonsnake (talk • contribs) 06:55, August 2, 2011 (UTC)

Just a tip. End of the World and Contract with the Abyss both require you to have exact levels for ritual summoning. Just thought I'd thrown that in there. They do both, however, allow you to use Star Blast on the ritual monster itself due to not stating the level required to use them. Dragoonsnake (talk • contribs) 07:00, August 2, 2011 (UTC)

Oh wow. That certainly is a lot of information, you've given me a lot of ideas for a Tribute Deck! Unfortunately, I think that'll have to wait for a little while as I've recently run into some car trouble and need the money for that. However, why those specific Ritual Monsters? They seem to be a bit lacking in essence of raw power, though their effects do carry a lot of weight.

But I'll be definitely keep an eye for those cards, and I know down the line I'm gonna be taking some cards from my current deck and recycling the cards into future decks, a ritual deck like you've described included. Anyways, thank you, I certainly got a lot of ideas from you. Ember113 (talk • contribs) 19:39, August 2, 2011 (UTC)

This is my take. pared it down some. My rule of thumb is no more than 3-4 level 7+ monsters and 2-3 Level 5-6 Don't get monsters or spells dependent on too certian a criteria. It's ok to run normal monsters, as long as they are the best ones of serve a purpose. Check out the article on here about staples. Those cards ALWAYS work in decks. Compulsory could use a few more copies. I say run 18-22 monsters and either half and half the rest spells and traps OR something like a ratio of 12-8 or 13-6. Getting cards that work together is cool, getting cards that DEPEND on each other is something i avoid.Arkieboy72472 (talk • contribs) 07:31, August 2, 2011 (UTC) Arkieboy72472 (talk • contribs) 07:18, August 2, 2011 (UTC)

Wow. Thank you for that. I did just about everything you suggested, but I'm a little on the fence about getting rid of the White-Horned Dragon, but then again I don't have really any cards that can Normal Summon it and only a few that can Special Summon it. So that card might have to wait for a Dark-Dragon type deck or something along those lines. I also kept the Magic Jammer as I have found too many uses for that card.

Again, thank you. Ember113 (talk • contribs) 19:39, August 2, 2011 (UTC)

It was stated that cards that depend on eachother, such as White Hole or Anti Raigeki, should be avoided. I wholeheartedly agree with that. Ritual decks, however, are made to get the cards you need out of the deck, in a similar way you'd get out Exodia. And to the ratio comment, they're a bad idea. Every deck has their own chemistry, and should be treated as such. Not even the total amount of cards should be set in stone when creating a deck. Normal Monsters, more often than not, have a better effect-monster alternative. Some monsters have a spell or trap that works better, or some spells or trap have a monster that pulls off their effect more than once. There should be no set ratio between monsters to spells or traps. Hell, there should be no set amount of cards to put in the deck, aside from the 40-60 min/max. Dragoonsnake (talk • contribs) 08:21, August 2, 2011 (UTC)

While what you say is true, we are dealing with someone who has not played for a while. in this case, until he gets the hang of it, I suggested sticking to the traditional 20/10/10 format until he starts playing and gets used to it. What your saying is true, but do note the fewer cards you have the more the chance of getting what you need when you need it. There are so many cards, not to mention the varying levels of rarity you must maintain, and not to mention there are 2 formats. It can get very confusing quickly. Since I got back to playing they have introduced synchron's, and so many lines of monsters you can forget what they all do. There are a time and place for normal monsters, but I agree usually all effect guys are better. Mainly I want him to avoid having dead draws, which is why i pared down the redundant high level stuff. I also know that some people play cards that are so-so, like dark magician, because they just like them. with what he has, will he be able to deal with todays awesome decks? probably not...will he be able to have fun and win occationally? sure. Arkieboy72472 (talk • ributions/Arkieboy72472|contribs]]) 15:07, August 2, 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for that. My suggestion is to start with a broad based theme like atribute or type and work from there. Maybe a named theme like dark world later on. Play to the cards strengths. spalsh a few staples here and there and look at maybe a 40-45 card deck. look at possible card combos, and later on, cards that fetch those combos. Like resk says, if it is good enough to run, it's good enough to run 3 of. Dont be afraid of normal monsters (and oh, Ancient Rules ) if they help or enhance your deck. Also look at spells, traps, and effects that protect the monsters once in play. synchron and fushion decks are nasty. protect yourself from those awesome effects once you get going - this depends on what the play group you run with plays as well. lastly, test it out online many times on the dueling network if you can. it can not hurt and it is free. look at decks pre made on here. read the card tips for cards. have fun! Arkieboy72472 (talk • contribs) 23:07, August 2, 2011 (UTC)