Forum:Judgement dragon vs book of moon

Can his effect be used?does it also get destroyed?can they flip it back up in the same turn? — This unsigned comment was made by 141.157.231.10 (talk • contribs) 05:42, December 30, 2009

after you chain book of moon during his effect activation (pay 1000 and destroy all other cards) it is not destroyed (see rulings)

if you chain book of moon after its special summon from hand, it can be flipped summoned since his effect states that he cannot be normal summoned or set and can only be special summoned from hand by having 4 or more lightsworn monster with different names in the grave June23ly 04:00, December 31, 2009 (UTC)— This unsigned comment was made by June23ly (talk • contribs) 06:34, December 30, 2009

After "Judgment Dragon" is Summoned, the Turn Player can activate the effect of "Judgment Dragon" before the opponent can do anything. The opponent can only activate "Book of Moon" in Chain to the effect of "Judgment Dragon".

If "Judgment Dragon" cannot be Flip Summoned if this is the same turn that it was Special Summoned. A card cannot change its Battle Position the same turn that it was Summoned and a Flip Summoning includes changing a monster's Battle Position, so you cannot Flip Summon "Judgment Dragon" if it was Special Summoned this turn.

Also, remember to sign your posts with four tildes ~~~~, since that automatically creates a signature for you.

--Deus Ex Machina (Talk) 03:38, December 31, 2009 (UTC)

so does that mean all monsters that changed position by card effect cannot be changed again manually? so if a book of eclipse is used, i cant flip my monster because it is face up, then facedown by a card effect but if it is facedown alady before and after book of eclipse resolves i can flip it? And what do you mean by only book of moon or eclipse can chained to judgment dragon and similar cards? can i chain bottomless for instance? or it will miss the timing since after the summon the owner will trigger its effect?re June23ly 04:00, December 31, 2009 (UTC)

First, what I said only applies if the monster was Summoned this turn. If the monster was Summoned on a previous turn, then it can be Flip Summoned after "Book of Moon" flips it face-down.

You cannot manually change a monster's Battle Position if (1) the monster was Summoned this turn, or (2) the monster attacked this turn, or (3) the monster already had its Battle Position manually changed this turn. Flipping a monster face-down with "Book of Moon" or "Book of Eclipse" is none of these.

• Example: You control "Jain, Lightsworn Paladin", which has already been on the field for several turns. You Normal Summon "Ehren, Lightsworn Monk", and your opponent then activates "Book of Eclipse". "Ehren, Lightsworn Monk" CANNOT change its Battle Position (and thus can't be Flip Summoned), since it has been Summoned this turn. "Jain, Lightsworn Paladin" CAN change its Battle Position, since it hasn't been Summoned this turn, it hasn't attacked this turn, and it hasn't had its Position manually changed during this turn.

By my first paragraph, I was just explaining that "Book of Moon" has to be Chained to the effect of "Judgment Dragon", and not the other way around. "Bottomless Trap Hole" can still be activated, since everything in the Chain is being activated in response to the Summon.

--Deus Ex Machina (Talk) 04:52, December 31, 2009 (UTC)

So it means only summoned monsters in that turn (including SETS?) cannot be flipped again after being flipped facedown by Book of Eclipse, does it also mean if my opponent enters battle phase and i chained Book of Eclipse in respond to his attack declaration, in his main phase 2 he can flip all of his monsters yes (except the monster/s he/she sets that turn) or he can't flip them up because it entered battle phase? (too confused about this)

June23ly 05:52, December 31, 2009 (UTC) June23ly 05:52, December 31, 2009 (UTC)

A monster can't change its Position if it was Set from your hand during this turn. (Note that flipping a monster face-down by a card effect is also called Setting it, but this doesn't prevent you from changing its Position.)

A monster can't change its Position if it declared an attack. Just entering the Battle Phase is not enough - the monster has to attack.

• Example: You control "Jain, Lightsworn Paladin" and "Ehren, Lightsworn Monk", both of whom have been on the field for several turns. You enter the Battle Phase, and have "Jain, Lightsworn Paladin" attack; your opponent activates "Book of Eclipse" in response to the attack. During the Main Phase 2, "Jain, Lightsworn Paladin" CANNOT change its Battle Position, since it declared an attack during this turn. "Ehren, Lightsworn Monk" CAN change its Position, since it didn't declare an attack.

--Deus Ex Machina (Talk) 06:35, December 31, 2009 (UTC)

ok now i understand only the monster who declared attack is the only one who cannot be changed manually in main phase 2, that means only the monsters who didn't declare an attack and monsters not summoned in that turn can change its battle position. thanks alot June23ly 10:44, December 31, 2009 (UTC)