Forum:Obelisk the tormentor vs shallow grave confusion

I took a look at obelisk the tormentor vs shallow grave, and I still do not understand why obelisk the tormentor is still sent to the graveyard during the end phase if he got flip summoned, the end phase effect of obelisk the tormentor is a trigger effect, so it should not be applied if it gets flip summoned after being special summoned face-down defense however it should still applied if he got flip face-up because of an attack,and/or card effect since that is not a new summoned, I am well inform that flip summoned is also a flip face-up however since it is a summoned, the trigger effect should not check if obelisk the tormentor got special summoned before being flip summoned. The only way the way mention in obleisk the tormentor vs shallow grave would work, if obelisk the tormentor end phase trigger effect is also classified as lingering-like.Supernickid (talk • contribs) 18:48, July 3, 2013 (UTC)

If you Special Summon a Gemini Monster and then Normal Summon it, it will still be treated as a monster that is on the field because of a Special Summon (so it will be destroyed by effects like "Special Hurricane" and "Fossil Dyna Pachycephalo"). If you Special Summon a monster face-down then it is flipped face-up (for any reason), it is still a Special Summoned monster. Basically, the monster never forget how it was first summoned. --Missign0 (talk • contribs) 02:19, July 4, 2013 (UTC)

It only forget how it was first summoned if it leaves the field, except for special summoned only, special summoned only monster cards remember they are special properly as long as they remain in the graveyard and banish zone. Special summoned only, monster cards only forget they where summoned properly if they return to hand, deck, extra deck, and if their flip summoned is negated.Supernickid (talk • contribs) 11:45, July 4, 2013 (UTC)