Forum:Card image naming policy

Let me just start off by saying that everyone that works with card images is probably going to hate me for this. Please, though, hold your vitriol for the end.

Currently, our image naming policy is somewhat arbitrary (it's also far too limited in scope, but that's another issue =D ): image names should carry over exclamation points and commas from card names, but pretty much nothing else. This is a problem because now, whenever an editor wants to upload a card image for a card whose name has non-alphanumeric characters, they have to remember: do I remove apostrophes? How about dashes or ampersands?

This is to say nothing of how, for whatever reason, we require a hyphen-minus between everything except the card's name and the set/medium the image is from - another point of inconsistency, and it means templates cannot (at least not easily or trivially, and in the vast majority of cases simply cannot) automatically determine the set/medium an image is from by just using the image name.

So, my proposal is twofold:

1. card image names should exclude all characters from the card name except for alphanumeric characters (we would still want alphanumeric characters with accents, ligatures, and the like, in the rare cases they are used), and
2. every part of the image name (ignoring the image extension, of course) should be separated by a hyphen-minus.

This means that we will have to rename every single card image currently uploaded, but as I said the last time I proposed updating our image policy in this manner, it would not be something we'd have to complete overnight, and we already have one template (with more planned) that can be used to automatically tag images that need to be renamed, reducing the entire operation to a single click on an admin's part, once the template has been added.

Thoughts? Suggestions? Vitriol? =D 「ディノ奴千？！」^{? · ☎ Dinoguy1000} 05:31, October 20, 2011 (UTC)

• I'm fine with this, I upload lots of images and build galleries all the time so an easier way to do it would be fine by me. And when you say every part will be separated by a hyphen, would it look some thing like this: "CardName-SET1-EN-C-1E.jpg" as opposed to what we do now "CardNameSET1-EN-C-1E.jpg"? Look234 (talk • contribs) 05:39, October 20, 2011 (UTC)

I was wondering why it was CardNameSET-LN-R-ED-Misc.png and not CardName-SET-LN-R-ED-Misc.png for a while, when it's easier to bot certain things when each thing is separated... never got to asking though. -Falzar FZ- (talk page|useful stuff) 05:53, October 20, 2011 (UTC)

Look234: yeah, that's exactly how it'll be.

Falzar: It has literally been that way since the very first version of the image policy, all the way back in 2006.

Also, needless to say, if anyone else has any questions about or suggestions for further changes to the image policy, it's best to state them now, rather than just wondering quietly to yourself or assuming there must be a good reason it's done as it is. If we're going to change it, we might as well get as much changed at once as we can. =) 「ディノ奴千？！」^{? · ☎ Dinoguy1000} 07:18, October 20, 2011 (UTC)

Like how... although there are no 1Es in the OCG, we don't add UE to them even though there are LE and DT in the OCG, which means some OCG cards have the -ED tag, while others don't. -Falzar FZ- (talk page|useful stuff) 10:08, October 20, 2011 (UTC)

Actually, that's only on Japanese cards; as far as Deltaneos and I (and, IIRC, Cheesedude) have been able to determine, there has never been a Japanese card released as any edition other than UE - this includes cards in the Limited Edition Packs and Duel Terminal sets, and promotional cards up to and including tournament prize cards. Korean and Asian-English cards have been released as non-UE editions (with only 3 prints in existence, Chinese cards aren't worth worrying about IMO). Deltaneos has stated that he prefers not using the edition tag on Japanese card images because of this, though I disagree with him, since it would be more consistent (and simpler to code in templates) to go ahead and use the tag anyway. 「ディノ奴千？！」^{? · ☎ Dinoguy1000} 17:36, October 20, 2011 (UTC)

The code tag was only ever designed for use on TCG cards. Most Japanese cards don't have anything other than UE, so putting UE on all cards just adds dead weight to a filename. In the TCG, they actually serve a useful purpose.

As for Why we have xxxSET rather than xxx-SET, that was down to personal preference on how the filename looked. It just seemed odd to have a hyphen at the end of the name. As usual, most of the things we have today were thought of without thinking the place would be as big as it is today.--TwoTailedFox (My Talk Page) 21:26, October 21, 2011 (UTC)

This sounds fine to me. I sort of always wondered why there wasn't a dash before the set name. And the less confusing the policy is overall, the better. And it would be simpler like this. Updates like this are sort of in the very nature of wikis, for the reason TTF stated. Yeah, I was a little annoyed at the appearances update thing, but I was mostly joking. And you don't recall correctly, Dinoguy. I had nothing to do with helping to determine the UE issue. Cheesedude (talk • contribs) 16:48, October 24, 2011 (UTC)

Yeah, I know you were mostly joking around about the appearances update. You should consider my above mentions of it to be tongue-in-cheek. =D

Hmm... maybe it was Falzar, then? Maybe I should grok Delt's archives rather than randomly naming people off? XD

TwoTailedFox: should I take your comment to mean you're fine with all the proposed changes except for adding -UE to Japanese cards? 「ディノ奴千？！」^{? · ☎ Dinoguy1000} 02:17, October 25, 2011 (UTC)

Yes.--TwoTailedFox (My Talk Page) 22:10, October 25, 2011 (UTC)

If it doesn't relate to the anime/manga in more than a tangential way, it probably wasn't me. And I know agree with this change even more. Card Gallery:Double or Nothing!. I just moved two images and did not include the "!", since I always thought it was meant to be removed. Cheesedude (talk • contribs) 06:17, October 25, 2011 (UTC)

Every symbol/special character used in the card page names are: -.,'":!・/~&Ωαβγ=àãæéÉÜöüú?%

Which do we ignore exactly?

too bad moving images does not automatically update the links on the pages using them...-Falzar FZ- (talk page|useful stuff) 11:20, October 25, 2011 (UTC)

The only punctuation that is currently supposed to be left in is commas and exclamation marks. If a card name has any letters with diacritic marks, or uses [insert non-Latin writing system here] characters, these are also supposed to be left in. This proposal eliminates the former, while keeping the latter. 「ディノ奴千？！」^{? · ☎ Dinoguy1000} 17:17, October 25, 2011 (UTC)

So...

Keep: ,!ΩαβγàãæéÉÜöüú

Don't keep: -.'":・/~&=?%

-Falzar FZ- (talk page|useful stuff) 01:41, October 26, 2011 (UTC)

Currently, yes. However, after this, the comma and exclamation mark will move to the "don't keep" list.

Speaking of, almost all of our "major players" have commented in support here, so I think we might as well go ahead with this now, if there are no objections to doing so (in which case, I'll update the image policy tomorrow). 「ディノ奴千？！」^{? · ☎ Dinoguy1000} 02:01, October 26, 2011 (UTC)

I did say why Japanese images don't use the edition portion of the filename, but I don't think I said I was necessarily in favour. I know there aren't going to be any conflicting filenames without it, but if it's only to avoid the same image name applying to two different prints, it shouldn't be necessary for LE, DT or SC on non-Japanese cards either. I think it would be more consistent if we included it for all languages and maybe make it easier for {{OCG-TCG card image}}.

Since Strategy Cards are being mixed in with editions, the Japanese version has FAQ cards, which could be added to their list of editions. -- Deltaneos (talk) 20:29, October 27, 2011 (UTC)

Hmm... On that note, what would be keeping us from treating Official Proxy (OP) and Giant Card (GC) versions of cards as editions as well (and is there anything else we could do so with as well, while we're at it)? 「ディノ奴千？！」^{? · ☎ Dinoguy1000} 01:46, October 28, 2011 (UTC)

Just me applying what I thought was the reason for not having UE at the end of OCG cards. I don't mind changing if it those get changed. -Falzar FZ- (talk page|useful stuff) 01:51, October 28, 2011 (UTC)

While Giant Cards I can see being tracked, if we were to start tracking Official Proxy cards, we would have to use Konami-published images (otherwise, we couldn't really say "Official").--TwoTailedFox (My Talk Page) 00:22, October 30, 2011 (UTC)

For the OPs in Category:Official proxies without source, most of them are from Konami TCG site/strategy site. YuGiOh! World and ToyWiz use resized versions of Konami Press Release Mail images I think.

-Falzar FZ- (talk page|useful stuff) 00:50, October 30, 2011 (UTC)

VG

It's already hard to keep track of which TF image is already uploaded, and also because video game images always has the exact same tag "VG-", can the "-" thing only be applied to OCG/TCG card images (which have different tags for most of the cards)? -Falzar FZ- (talk page|useful stuff) 13:48, November 10, 2011 (UTC)

Actually, why don't we just swap the "VG" and "Game" tags? That would line them up with OCG/TCG images and allow templates to much more easily handle both types of image (it would also allow you to do a Special:PrefixIndex search for all uploaded images of a particular card from a particular set/game, if for whatever reason you wanted to). 「ディノ奴千？！」^{? · ☎ Dinoguy1000} 16:38, November 10, 2011 (UTC)

I didn't think of it at the time, but to line up with OCG/TCG images, we'd actually have to move the "VG" tag to the end of the filename, right before the file extension - so we'd go from "YourCardHere-VG-ABBR-LN.ext" to "YourCardHere-ABBR-LN-VG.ext". We could do the same for anime and manga (and other) images as well. 「ディノ奴千？！」^{? · ☎ Dinoguy1000} 06:13, November 13, 2011 (UTC)

I was suggesting a reason to not change it... -Falzar FZ- (talk page|useful stuff) 07:19, November 13, 2011 (UTC)

I know. The logic behind my comments was that you would have less of a problem with the change if it actually did something objectively useful (making VG card image names as consistent as possible with OCG/TCG card image names) instead of just prettifying the names a bit. =) 「ディノ奴千？！」^{? · ☎ Dinoguy1000} 20:38, November 13, 2011 (UTC)

Well, if I can track the images easily without having duplicate images or redirects then it wouldn't be a problem... or if someone moves all the images.

-Falzar FZ- (talk page|useful stuff) 04:55, November 15, 2011 (UTC)

[[:File:CardName{{#ifexist:File:CardNameVG-TF05-JP.png|VG-TF05-JP|-TF05-JP-VG}}.png]]

File:GenexAllyRemote-TF05-JP-VG.png

File:BattleFader-TF05-JP-VG.png

File:TheFabledUnicore-TF05-JP-VG.png

Problem solved. (But is there a way to simplify it? especially so that it only needs to say CardName once) (and red links = upload not edit) -Falzar FZ- (talk page|useful stuff) 05:15, November 15, 2011 (UTC)

Yeah, template it. =) This also fixes the redlinks = upload problem, by way of {{ #ifexist: File:TheFabledUnicoreVG-TF05-JP.png | [[:File:TheFabledUnicoreVG-TF05-JP.png]] | {{ #ifexist: File:TheFabledUnicore-TF05-JP-VG.png | [[:File:TheFabledUnicore-TF05-JP-VG.png]] | [{{fullurl:File:TheFabledUnicore-TF05-JP-VG.png|action=edit}} File:TheFabledUnicore-TF05-JP-VG.png] }} }} - yeah, it's pretty messy, but again, template. =) The only problem is that #ifexist is an expensive ParserFunction, meaning it can be used a maximum of 100 times per page. There is no way I'm aware of to "trick" the parser into telling us if a page exists without using #ifexist, either; I've given the problem a lot of thought over the years. 「ディノ奴千？！」^{? · ☎ Dinoguy1000} 08:18, November 15, 2011 (UTC)

File:GenexAllyRemote-TF05-JP-VG.png

File:BattleFader-TF05-JP-VG.png

File:TheFabledUnicore-TF05-JP-VG.png

Works, but Warning: This page contains too many expensive parser function calls. It should have less than 100 calls, there are now 1219 calls. Way past the limit; guess that's the only problem now, unless I split each set into its own page... but some sets have 80 cards and each one requires 2 calls... -Falzar FZ- (talk page|useful stuff) 10:39, November 15, 2011 (UTC)

Probably the best solution that wouldn't require creating a dozen subpages would be to hardlink to images that are known to be uploaded with the correct title. Your template currently colors these green; it may be better to have it color images with the old-style name some color other than blue (or green ;) ) and just let the "correct" image names default to blue so you wouldn't have to hardcode a bunch of <span style="color:green"> tags everywhere. This won't fix them all at once, but as earlier images are moved and the template removed from their entries, later ones will start working, and if you're wanting to do the work in batches, it's already perfectly set up for batches of 50. ;) 「ディノ奴千？！」^{? · ☎ Dinoguy1000} 17:10, November 15, 2011 (UTC)

Done

The image policy page has been updated. Note that I haven't yet updated {{OCG-TCG card image}} or any other templates that might need it (I don't think there are any others, but I could be wrong). 「ディノ奴千？！」^{? · ☎ Dinoguy1000} 07:42, October 27, 2011 (UTC)