Forum:September 2013 Banlist Predictions

My Predictions

We're still a ways away from September (May 5 now) but there's a lot of action going on now, especially with the recent TCG release of Hidden Arsenal 7. Here are my current predictions for the September 2013 banlist:

Banned:

• Mind Control - This card is way overdue IMO. Yeah you can't attack with or tribute the monster, but most of us don't care about that when you can always synchro or xyz summon with it anyways.
• Pot of Avarice - Same as Mind Control. This isn't very likely, but this card still gives way too much recycling power and draw power, especially in the mid and late games.
• Spellbook of Judgment - This card makes prophecies way too fast, and it's so searchable and recyclable that a ban is virtually the only way to solve the problem.

Limited:

• Atlantean Dragoons - Mermail-Atlanteans need to be hit this format. This card is why they're so consistent; searching an entire type by itself is way too good IMO.
• Rescue Rabbit - Rabbits aren't quite as good as they once were without Sangan, but if you insist on hitting Dinos, Evilswarms, and Fire Fists do this. They can still search and reuse it with Gold Sarc/Leviair anyways.
• Sinister Serpent - I honestly think this card is worth testing at 1. Running it in Mermails is like running it in Dark Worlds -- You'll always have something better to pitch in both decks, and Divine Wrath/Lightning Vortex ect are just bad in the current metagame.
• Tidal, Elemental Dragon of Cascades - Mermail-Atlanteans would abuse this card if it stays unlimited, since they can already make enough rank 7's with Abyssmegalo/Abyssteus, ect. It's also a great way to trigger Dragoons, Marksman, Infantry, Gunde/Hilde, ect. This and Tempest should go to 1 to slow down e-drags.
• Tempest, Elemental Dragon of Cyclones - There's a LOT of hate over the Elemental Dragons, and while they can be sided against quite easily in games 2 and 3, they're still too powerful with 3 copies of this. Like Dragoons, Tempest can search an entire type by itself. Limit this and Tidal (above) to 1, and the deck is still playable, but not broken.
• (Maybe) Wind-Up Carrier Zenmaity - Personally I think Konami over-hit Wind-ups with the March 2013 lists, but I don't really expect this to happen since Konami rarely undoes a banned change just one format later.
• Fire Formation - Tenki - ROTA for Beast-Warriors. Nuff said really.

Semi-Limited:

• T.G. Striker - T.G. Agents haven't made a huge impact on the current meta; this could come down to 2 to give them a better chance.
• One for One - With Disc Commander, Fishborg Blaster, Substitoad, and Mind Master now banned, this could come down to 2 to give slower decks a chance.
• Solemn Warning - This card was balanced at 2 to slow down the tons of special summons we see in today's metagame. Double Warning first turn can be irritating, but it's not that hard to get around, especially in a format where everyone mains Storm and 3 mst's.

Unlimited:

• Thunder King Rai-Oh - Either this, or limit it to one. I prefer this. No one ran more than 2 T-King's begin with.
• Tsukuyomi - The Tsukuyomi Lockdown is not playable so long as Time Seal stays banned, so...why not?
• Magical Stone Excavation - This card just doesn't see play anymore. Diamond Dude Turbo, Empty Jar, and Fableds are the only decks that really run this card in today's metagame, none of which are threatening the current meta in the first place.
• Mirror Force - There have been fewer decks running this card as a main deck staple since it came down to 2, and it's usually viewed as being inferior to Bottomless, Torrential, Warning, Compuls, and D-Prison with the amount of destruction, negation, and protection power against it. Even if Mirror Force does get unlimited, I doubt anyone would run 3.

Well, these are my current predictions. Any comments on them? 98.206.70.2 (talk) 12:37, May 5, 2013 (UTC)

I don't think we'll see Pot of Avarice hit, it's been at 1 for at least 3 formats and seems to be fine there. As for Atlanteans, Dragoons might help slow the deck down, but it might also not be enough. I think that Tenki should get hit, but only if we get Brotherhood of the Fire Fist - Chicken. I don't really have much to say about the other choices. But I do want to add that I think we'll have a somewhat good shot of getting some hits for cards in Lord of the Tachyon Galaxy, mostly because it allows both the TCG and OCG to play E-Drags at Worlds. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 00:27, May 7, 2013 (UTC)

I think that Dragoons helps in slowing it down, but Mermail-Atlanteans might still be too good if Mermail Abysslinde stays unlimited. Limiting that to 1 along with Dragoons might be enough, or too much. Tenki is the only real problem with the deck; it can be easily searched in fire fists anyways (by plenty of other cards than Chicken -- Bear, Gorilla, Tiger King, ect), and can be reused since it's continuous. Limiting it to 1 solves every broken aspect with Fire Fists. With regards to LOTTG, I don't think the Mecha Phantom Beasts will get hit; at most maybe Dracossack to 2 or 1, but Dracossack is not the problem with E-Drags as you only need one to make a first turn LaDD anyways, or pull off other combos with it. As much as I hate going up against a first turn LaDD, limiting Tempest is likely the best thing to slow them down, yet still keep them alive; if that doesn't happen I could also see an outright ban on REDMD. Battlin' Boxers aren't hard to get around, and I don't think they'll get hit either. Unless Prophecies start topping, same goes for Spellbook Judgment Day. However, it's pretty hard to call which cards, if any, will be banned; that's kinda opinion based, and it's difficult to predict what Konami will ban sometimes. (BLS is broken, but it hasn't done much on the tournament scene overall. Reborn is broken, but everyone can use it, so why complain? Gateway is a win button, but Six Sams aren't doing anything. Card Destruction is a win button for Dark Worlds and Fableds, but like Sams, neither of them are doing anything. Offering is broken, but it isn't consistent in the decks it's used in, by virtue of being limited). (meh, made some spelling errors) 98.206.70.2 (talk) 15:22, May 7, 2013 (UTC)

(Edit) After i've put some more thought into my list, I think this is what will happen. 98.206.70.2 (talk) 16:55, May 8, 2013 (UTC) 65.131.54.202 (talk) 22:18, May 17, 2013 (UTC)

My Preditions

Banned:

Mind Control - this card Has been used to synchro or xyz monsters by using your opponent's monster, also you can steal a monster your opponent controls and use it for a cost of an effect other than tribute cost. Its best to ban this card especially when Judgment of the Light is coming out with new synchro monsters.

Limited:

Mermail Abyssmegalo - This card is the main reason why Mermail/Atlantean Decks are topping. This is one of the cards that make the deck look fast, also this card causes Otk/Ftks. limiting this can solve the problem.

Atlantean Dragoons - This is another card that makes Mermail/Atlantean Decks look fast, also this can make your 3 or lower sea serpents attack directly. Limiting this card can help slow down the deck.

Rescue Rabbit - Rescue Rabbit has dominated 3 formats with Dino Rabbits. Also now there are other decks that are using this card such as Evilswarms, Fire Fist, Harpies, Gem-Knights, etc. This card won't dominate much if its limited.

Sinister Serpent - Too slow for the meta nowanddays, even the dark door combo with this card can handle the speed of the new decks, especially with 3 MSTs and Heavy Storm.

Imperial Order - Not as broken as it used to be when the meta got faster. Also, there are decks now that has spell/trap removal cards that arent spell cards, meaning this card might not last as much on the field. Also top decks wouldnt really run this card. Also Royal Decree is unlimited, so...

Gold Sarcophagus - the Dragon Ruler archetype can use this card to banish a Dragon Ruler monster (level 7 ones) from your deck, then using the effect of the Dragon Ruler monster adding a dragon of their element from the deck to the hand, making you not lose much hand advantage and getting the banished Dragon Ruler monster to your hand at the 2nd Standby Phase.

Fire Formation - Tenki - This card can bring out almost any the Fire Fist monster from your deck to your hand. also you can use this card in other decks that has Beast Warrior monsters. This card can be brought out your deck by most of the Fire Fist monster's effect.

Semi-Limited:

Mermail Abysslinde - Although this card can bring out any Mermail moster other than herself, her effect can really only be used once per turn.

Gladiator Beast Bestiari - Gladiator Beast arent doing nothing.

Formula Synchron - Not as good anymore due to the good level 1 tuners banned. also this card isnt really doing much in the current meta.

Mezuki - Zombie decks arent doing anything.

Book of Moon - popular decks really runs this card anymore.

One for One - Plant decks really only use this card, and they arent topping.

Unlimited

Debris Dragon - Not much useable in this format.

Tsukuyomi - no one uses this card.

Advanced Ritual Art - No one really uses ritual decks anymore.

Magical Stone Excavation - Same as Tsukuyomi.

Reasoning - Same as Tsukuyomi.

Mirror Force - This card really never gets a chance to use it's effect after it gets blown-up by a card effect. Torrential Tribute is considered better than this card cause it can break strategies that this card can't. Mecha Phantom Beast monsters arent really gonna be affected by this card. Also most people wouldn't really run more than 2.

Thats what i think my predition is, any comments? Guardian Skunk (talk • contribs) 15:23, May 10, 2013 (UTC)

Formula Synchron can't come back, Plants still exist and Synchron decks can probably make use of this card, same with One for One. Gladiator Beast Bestiari won't come down because then all of a sudden you get Gladiator Beast Gyzarus spam, not really fun. I also don't think Imperial Order is going to come down, I think it's been proven time and time again that decks can win without trap line-ups, but they can't really win without spells. It's a broad generalization, but really true, plus not all decks can run trap or Monster removal effects, some can but not all. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 01:32, May 11, 2013 (UTC)

I could see Formula Synchron come down to 2 at some point, but it still gives Synchro decks lots of draw power, especially with T.G. Hyper, and T.G. Striker or One for One to 2 would be better. One for One isn't all that good with Disc Commander, Substitoad, Mind Master, Glow-Up Bulb, and Magical Scientist now banned, so it might not do much harm at 2. Also, if you wanted to hit E-Drags, Gold Sarc isn't the best way to go, neither is Necroface or LaDD. REDMD getting banned is a possibility, but hitting some of the big e-drags is probably the best way to go. If you think Bestiari or Mezuki should come down from one...yeah you probrably haven't faced a descent Glad Beast or Zombie build in a while. They're still a pain to go up against sometimes, even with their key cards limited (Plaguespreader also a key card in zombies). Glads can already search their 1 Bestiari with 3 Test Tigers and/or 3 Gladiator Proving Grounds. Book of Moon coming down is a possibility, but when Konami unlimited it a while back, people abused the hell out of it, so they limited it again to prevent abuse from it. It's pretty much a trap in the form of a spell; it seems fine at one. Unfortunately for Imperial Order, it's probrably never going to leave the forbidden list. One, yes everyone would run the card, and two, we're instantly going to have a "set 5 backrows and end my turn format" if Order comes back, except Heavy Storm and Mst won't be there to save you. That and, you can just choose not pay 700 in your standby to activate spells on your turn and create ridiculous otk's. Unbanning Order is pretty much the equivalent of banning Storm -- it ain't gonna happen. 75.5.237.113 (talk) 12:34, May 11, 2013 (UTC)

Wow, have any of you been paying attention to Dueling Network? Only 2-3 Decks are being used: Dragon Rulers, Spellbook, and Evilswarm. The problem are the first 2 'cause they're too versatile. Spellbook of Judgment will definitely get limited and maybe Spellbook of Secrets. For Dragon Rulers, the mini-ones should be Limited, and everything else - semi-limited. Evilswarm is only there because it's one of the only ways to counter the others. Seriously, if you've been only playing TCG for now, you don't know what Lord of the Tachyon Galaxy will do to the meta. 190.124.165.194 (talk) 23:17, May 17, 2013 (UTC)

Dueling Network doesn't always give true results of what competitive players use, and even so, I'm not sure if those 3 are the only ones to be talking about. Fire Fists and Mermails have dominated the TCG this format, with Mermails winning 4 YCS's and winning against Fire Fists in the last rounds of Austin and San Diego. Evilswarms only got 2 of the top 32 at Meadowlands, the only YCS they could make an appearance in this format (Mermails got 15 of the top 32 there, including 1st place). If anything Rabbit needs to go to 1 to slow down Evilswarms. Nothing else really needs to be hit with them. The minis are not the problem with the dragon rulers; the big guys are the problem since 1) they're splashable into any deck of their attribute, and 2) their secondary effects are pretty broken, particularly Tempest's; it's practically Dragoons for Dragon-types. While prophecies are a pretty fun deck to play, they're having a hard time on the competitive scene in the TCG/OCG because they're so easy to counter in games 2 and 3. Evilswarms main deck (sometimes side deck) Eradicator Epidemic Virus to kill prophecies game 1, and dragon rulers also run it (to sack off no. 11 big eye and kill all their spells) to wipe them out as well. I strongly doubt spellbook of judgment will get hit because of that, and even if it is, the only solution IS to ban it. Limiting Judgment makes no sense as you have 3 Spellbook of Secrets, 3 Spellbook of the Master, and Justice of Prophecy/Spellbook Magician of Prophecy to easily search that one copy of Judgment. It's going to end up being abused every duel, even if it goes to 1. Tenki definitely needs to go to 1 to slow down Fire Fists, and so does Dragoons/Abysslinde for Mermail-Atlanteans. Some other decks could get a boost this format, but Prophecies, Evilswarms, and Dragon rulers are definitely not going to be the only 3 decks Konami will hit this September. 98.206.70.2 (talk) 14:26, May 18, 2013 (UTC)

in my opinion, it is time to hit Light and Darkness Dragon, consider how crazy to face him in elemental dragon ( we all know they often summon it in first turn with Mecha Phantom Beast Dracossack and Number 11: Big Eye. these 2 are serious abused right now. and yeah, in DN or/and maybe also in real life, they like to use 3 in the deck/ extra deck. the rest mostly i agree with u except reasoning, ARA, GB bestiari, debris dragon formula synchron,and tsukoyomi.Gemini 93 (talk • contribs) 06:49, May 19, 2013 (UTC)

LaDD is a pain to face in e-dragons. However, in my opinion, it's pointless to limit LaDD or Dragosac or Big Eye as you only need one (Ladd can be searched by elipse wyvern or Tempest) to win against your opponent anyways (just like you only needed one Brionac to win anyways). But I don't think any of them should get banned either since, tbh, they're only really abusable in the e-dragon deck. There's no other deck that can spam them with such consistency. The logical move would be to hit the big e-drags (Tidal, Tempest, Blaster, and Redox) and not the Xyz's made by them. In the same way, target the Rabbit, not the monster it summons. I'm kinda for the other options, though not for all of them. Bestiari and Mezuki would probrably be better off at 1, since they would be too good at 2, same for Formula Synchron. Herald of Perfection lockdowns and Demise/Doom OTK's still aren't relevant to today's meta so I could care less if Advanced Ritual Art comes down to 3, same with Reasoning since turbo OTK's are also inconsistent in today's meta. Tsukuyomi was only broken 7-8 years ago when it was involved in a lockdown with Mask of Darkness and Time Seal; you would get your opponent into a situation where they were topdecking with no cards in their hand and on their field, activate Time Seal in your main phase, flip Mask of Darkness, return Time Seal back, re-set it, summon Tsukuyomi, flip Mask back facedown, attack directly with Tsukuyomi, and repeat until victory. However, that lockdown is not playable anymore. After so many years, Konami has finally realized Time Seal was the real problem with that lockdown, and it's banned and never coming back. Drop off doesn't count as a substitute for Time Seal because discarding a drawn card can actually help your opponent. For that reason, Drop off just doesn't see play. Other loops, like Needle Worm and Man-Eater Bug loops with Tsukuyomi, are just downright bad in the current meta. I gurantee Tsukuyomi is coming down to 3. Like Breaker, it used to be broken, but now it's not. 98.206.70.2 (talk) 15:43, May 19, 2013 (UTC)

Wait wait what? Big Eye and Dracossack not being hit? remember dragunities? well they can also bring out draccosack and big eye and it's easy to get them out, and besides Big eye has too little cost for too much power, i mean if they took out snatch steal, were your opponent gains 1000 each turn they will take out big eye, for my prediction Dracossack will go down to 1 while big eye is going dirrectly to the ban list, while rabbit will stay at 2 because if they take out rabbit, they will kill the macro rabbit who no longer has sangan, and yes the evilswarm won't be as fast anymore but i've seen it played quite quickly using 1 or no rabbits, so for evilswarm i think ophion will go to 2 and bahamut as well while some of Infection will go down to 1. Advanced ritual art will stay were it is because of gishkis, Thunderking will stay at 2 because it's a beater with 1900 combined with a skill drain it's hard to take down and in case it does get taken down or skill drain does, the effect of one or the other can still be effected, your thinking too much about killing popular decks but taking a feew off the list can make a deck from the past come back, and for the same reason tsukuyomi won't come down to 3. I use a Macro Rabbit deck and with Imperial order idk i just think it'd be too much expecially since sometimes i think damn i wish he wudn't have activated heavy storm or typhoon, imperial order would solve that, expecially having trap stuns and laggias in the deck (btw yes the part about rescue rabbit is a bit bias in my case) (190.0.96.212 (talk) 05:53, June 27, 2013 (UTC))

The difference between Big Eye and Snatch Steal is Big Eye is harder to bring out and it's more vulnerable to destruction/negation than Snatch Steal. Snatch is also searchable and recyclable with hidden armory (which is at 3) so mst won't always save you from snatch steal and snatch can be splashed into any deck with full effect, whilst big eye cannot. It's a spell that gives you immediate control of an opponent's monster, making it much faster and quicker than big eye ever will be. Not every deck can run big eye and those that do don't always get a chance to use it's effect (veiler, breakthrough, bottomless, and many other cards). I highly doubt big eye will be hit. Dracossack is in the same boat as big eye. It's only very easily summonable in dragon rulers/mermails and it makes much more sense to hit the monsters that make the xyz monsters rather than the xyz's themselves. If you hit big eye and dragosack, dragon rulers will just find a way to become an broken synchro/tribute engine that could be even more potent than the xyz engine they have now. Gishkis don't run advanced ritual art to begin with (most good builds run aquamirror instead), so it's pointless to mention it's broken because of them, and Herald of Perfection lockdowns/Demise, King of Armageddon OTK's aren't doing anything anymore either. I don't see why ritual art can't be at 3. Thunder King can shut down a large number of decks that rely on searching, like HEROs, Sams, and Prophecies, but if no one ran more than 2 to begin with, why keep it semi-limited? Either limit it to 1 if you hate cards that stop aggro (that likely won't happen since it would hurt anti-meta too much) or unlimit it since no one ran 3 anyways. How is Tsukuyomi broken anymore? No one runs it. Decks that use it to try to revolve around Mask of Darkness/Man-eater bug/Needle Worm are slow and just downright bad in this current gamestate. Like I said above, the original problem with the Tsukuyomi Lockdown was Time Seal (oh wait...it's banned). As long as it doesn't come back, I don't why Tsukuyomi can't be at 3. If it does something at 3...then maybe back to 2 again. I agree in the fact I don't like having all of my backrows blown up by Storm or mst turn 1, but the "set 5 and end my turn" formats will always suck more than having Storm screw you first turn. That's why I don't want Imperial Order to come back, if it comes back it'll be a "set everything on first turn" format. Those formats are lame and no fun to play in. I would initially want Rabbit to go to 1, but...the problem is, that would kill too many decks (including the aforementioned macro rabbit), and Evilswarms technically don't need more than 1 rabbit since they only have 1 vanilla to use anyways, Rabbit just becomes a little easier to draw into at 2. Ophion to 2 would be a more logical move, but the other Evilswarm exceeds (Bahamut, Thanatos, Nightmare, Ouroboros) don't need to be touched if that happens, neither do the infestation spell/trap cards. 98.206.70.2 (talk) 14:26, June 27, 2013 (UTC)

Prediction

Evilswarms are definitely going to get hit pretty hard, as are E Dragons. Evilswarm Bahumat is going to get either limited or banned, its basically Number 11: Big Eye, only much easier to summon, and at only the cost of discarding 1 card. C'mon.

69.65.88.14 (talk) 20:58, June 1, 2013 (UTC)

While Evilswarm Bahamut is easier to summon, it also needs a discard, which means you lose a monster from your hand to take one from your opponent. That's actually really fair. Even if you did summon it with Rescue Rabbit, you're going to break even in the end. Also, it's low ATK for a Rank 4 also means it's going to probably get run over the next turn. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 22:50, June 1, 2013 (UTC)

Evilswarms are, in general, just an anti-meta arechetype of DARK monsters that have lots of options open to them, but they aren't the best deck in today's meta. While they can counter Synchro, Ritual (Barring Relinquished), Fusion, and other decks that use lots of high-level monsters (Dragon Rulers, Chaos decks), Evilswarm Ophion doesn't really help them with their bad matchups against other decks that can also spam rank 4-5 xyz monsters and take them down, like "hunders", Constellars, Wind-Ups, Fire Fists, Heraldic Beasts, Infernities, and other decks like that. Limiting Rabbit to 1 would definitely hurt Evilswarms, but it also hurts many other decks, like Macro Rabbit (still one of the top decks in today's metagame). If Rabbit doesn't go to 1 Ophion might get a semi-limit, but I doubt Bahamut will be hit. Ophion is the key card in the deck. Ophion not only seals special summons from high-level monsters and has good atk for a rank 4, but it can also search for the deck's broken field-covering forbidden lance and deck searcher (Pandemic and Infection). 98.206.70.2 (talk) 03:01, June 2, 2013 (UTC)

So after all this here is my list i will not cover all changes just a few i think is needed R1 tempest, dragoons, abysslinde, tenki, tidal, rabbit, R2 secrets, blaster(fire kings,fire fist and ruler), fate R3 tsuky R0 judgement day

basicly that would slow down all tier 1 and some 2 and open the door for others decks becouse thoose is all we have seen in march format. that will be an open door for constellar and mecha beast phanton to grow up in setember.177.206.248.235 (talk) 04:34, June 2, 2013 (UTC)

I'm not really sure about Spellbook of Judgment, to be honest I think it could go to 1 or to 0. If it goes to 1 prophecies can still search it with secrets, master, and spellbook magician of prophecy, and reuse it with eternity, but prophecies don't need spellbook of judgment to be a good deck; they're still very playable without it. But if Judgment gets banned, secrets and fate don't need a hit alongside that. 98.206.70.2 (talk) 04:51, June 2, 2013 (UTC)

That's true, Prophecy don't need Judgment to be good, they need it to be great. The search power and speed that Judgment brings is what keeps Prophecy in the game. Also, Prophecy don't have any kind of explosive play, their main asset is card build-up and mega power boosts with Star Hall. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 12:55, June 2, 2013 (UTC)

Power plays with star hall and draw + recycling power/grave setup with spellbook tower (when it's destroyed) give prophecies some pretty nice advantages; Spellbook of Judgment is just there because it's an auto-win button for the deck. It gives them so much speed, search power, and field control (via Jowgen), it's not even funny. I faced prophecies before spellbook of judgment was released and they were MORE than playable; the arrival of judgment in LOTG just gave them that extra push to being one of the best decks in today's metagame. If Judgment isn't outright banned I could also see it going to 1, but you kinda only need one judgment to win anyways; the deck has 9 or 10 cards that can search it, and 3 Eternity to reuse it once Fate or Priestess banishes it from grave, so limiting it won't stop them from sacking. It'll make prophecies less consistent for sure, but not enough as to where they won't be able to abuse Judgment every duel in some way, shape, or form. 98.206.70.2 (talk) 20:40, June 2, 2013 (UTC)

Ok Prophecy are good or great but I believe that its price is higher than most people can afford, as they have a lot of cards that are over-prized and almost all of the deck has foiled cards, another thing to consider is that a lot of people want to play the two "new" meta decks (Dragon Ruler and Evilswarm), the Evilswarm is reasonable cheap to do (except Kerykeion and Ophion) so it is "the best choice" to some of the people in my community, Dragon Ruler are expensive (all of its rare cards are about $5 to $6 bucks) and Big Eye and Dracossac are way to expensive, none the less the last tournament (here in Mexico, before the finals in about one month) the only top 16 were evilswarm and dragon rulers, so I don´t see Prophecy being hit hard, and the last format Konami didn't hit the cards of recent packs (that time Mermails and Fire Fist), they decided to hit some things like Rai-Oh and One Day of Peace. I think its to early to make a prediction (at least for me) 'cause I have been wrong before. Jaggo 80 (talk • contribs) 14:25, June 3, 2013 (UTC)

Evilswarms aren't going to get hit that hard, if at all. Evilswarms are good against certain meta decks like Dragon Rulers but they have a terrible time with other decks that can spam their own rank 4 xyz monsters. Ophion doesn't lock down everything; I've beaten Evilswarms relatively easily with Wind-Ups and Constellars and plenty other xyz swarm decks. The only thing I can possibly see is Rabbit going to 1, and even that's not extremely likely. 75.40.248.154 (talk) 16:47, June 3, 2013 (UTC)

September 2013 Banlist?

Here's mine: Note* Add suggestions!

Limited: Infestation Pandemic: This card is so overpowered and it protects all of your Evilswarm monsters without a cost. It's extremely easy to search as Evilswarms have cards like Rescue Rabbit and Evilswarm Castor to easily make Ophion.

Number 11 Big Eye: I admit, as a Dragon player I have really screwed some players over by taking their monster. I admit, it does have a good cost, and does prevent massive OTK's, but taking a monster that could've had such valuable resources to make with such a cost that doesn't let you attack is too OP.

Battlin' Boxer Lead Yoke: Haha I'm going to Dark Hole that pathetic XYZ monster. Oh.. Never mind.

Unlimited: Mirror Force: Hmmm... Let's see, Dracossack isn't affected, Lead Yoke isn't affected, Shi En isn't affect, Ophion isn't affected (pandemic most of the time). This card has just gotten too useless in this format that it's gonna bump up to three. Nuff said.

Banned: Black Luster Soldier- Envoy of the Beginning: EASY TO SUMMON! CAN ATTACK TWICE! 3000 BEATER! Should be called OP soldier, starter of the end (of the duel).

Semi Limited: Mecha Phantom Beast Dracossack: I admit, this card can be overpowered but most of the time fairly easy to get over.

142.59.161.172 (talk) 00:22, June 5, 2013 (UTC) NC

But what has BLS done in this format? Sure it is all of the things you said, but has it really been overused to the point it needs to go back to the Forbidden side? I don't think so. As for hitting the various Xyz Monsters, Konami might decide to just hit the cards that make them, instead of them directly. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 12:29, June 5, 2013 (UTC)

Mirror Force to 3 isn't a bad idea. I like dem otk-discouragers, and you're right, it doesn't see much play anymore. As for Evilswarms, I think they will likely hit Rabbit to 1 to slow them down or perhaps Ophion could get semi-limited, but limiting or banning Infestation Pandemic or Ophion hurts the deck way too much, especially since it's not that hard to counter with other xyz swarm decks like Wind-Ups or Constellars. Bls probrably won't get banned since it hasn't done much in the current format, so I think he'll stay at 1. Also, Battlin' Boxers likely won't get hit so hard as to limiting yoke since they haven't done much on the OCG or TCG tournament scenes (P.S: try using compuls to get past yoke). Also, Big Eye and Dragossack aren't what make Dragon Rulers broken; it's how easily they can be summoned since Redox, Tempest, Blaster, and Tidal are all unlimited. If any of them went to 2 or 1 Dragossack and Big Eye become so much less relevant. 98.206.70.2 (talk) 12:56, June 5, 2013 (UTC)

OP? Not really

I think limiting all the adult dragon rulers would really hurt the deck. I have played many decks that counter my moves for first turn rank 7's. Compulsary Evac. Bottomless(ish). That one trap card that kills 2 monsters. MIRROR MATCH. OPHION. BIG EYE. It's a new format. A faster one. More competitive. It's time to get fast. It's time to adapt. It's nothing to complain about. It's a first turn format. Who goes first has an ADVANTAGE, not exactly game. IT's about recovering from the first turn Draccosack, ophion, priestess, Shi En, etc. I don't complain about Ophion. I don't complain about somebody big eyeing my big eye. It's just what's there.

Dragon rulers.

They aren't that OP. Sure, they can get out rank 7's but jeez louis it's easy to counter if you go first. Evilswarms can beat em. Antimeta. Mirror Match. Tidal Mermails. They're not undefeatable. 142.59.161.172 (talk) 16:48, June 5, 2013 (UTC)

Not all of the lv 7 dragon rulers should go to 1, I agree, but at least 1 or 2 of them should get hit to at least semi to slow down the deck. And just because a card or deck has counters doesn't mean these counters always work. If counters solved anything, should Chaos Emperor Dragon and Makyura the Destructor be unbanned since they can be countered? No way, counters don't make a card or deck less broken. You say Dragon Rulers aren't OP? They are overpowering and broken, no matter how you look at it, and the deck must be slowed down at least somewhat. It must be hit to the point where it's "good", but not the best deck around. Plenty of other decks got that treatment, like Wind-Ups, Inzektors, Chaos Dragons, Hieratics, ect. 98.206.70.2 (talk) 01:56, June 6, 2013 (UTC)

Listing mirror matches as something that can beat dragon rulers is stupid lol. I don't think any of the adult dragon rulers should even be touched. IMO the baby dragon rulers should be the ones that get hit. Mostly because they are the ones that make the deck really consistent. Before the baby dragons came out, they weren't that bad since they would use up a lot of their resources at once to even get out a rank 7.-- Aexon 17:31, June 6, 2013 (UTC)

Not to mention the baby dragons give more draws off of Super Rejuvenation. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 19:19, June 6, 2013 (UTC)

While it's true that the baby dragons are what gave the deck enough consistency to top in the first place, the babys aren't the "problem" with the deck. Limitng the babys won't do anything since 1) most dragon ruler decks that top in the OCG don't run more than 1 (sometimes 2) of each baby, and 2) they can still banish the big guys with seven star sword or gold sarcophagus to search their respective babys if the babys go to 1. The baby dragon rulers won't do that much if their lv 7 daddys get limited or semi-limited. All the babys did was break the daddys to the point where they're too hard to beat on the competitve level in the OCG. All of the dragon ruler decks that top in the OCG run 3 of each of the lv 7's, but they never run 3 of the minis, so hitting them would be dumb. Also, the big guys are splashable into several different decks of their own attributes, other than pure dragon rulers, so it would slow down the meta as a whole if the daddys got hit to 1 or to 2. Super rejuvenation is a great form of draw power, but it's only confined to one deck, and if the key lv 7 monsters of that deck get hit, super rejuvenation isn't so much of a problem. In a similar manner, if Dragoons or Abysslinde went to 1 or 2 to slow down Mermail-Atlanteans, other broken cards in that deck (like Moulinglacia the elemental lord) aren't as relevant. 98.206.70.2 (talk) 23:52, June 6, 2013 (UTC)

Actually, Moulinglacia has just fallen out of favor with many Mermail decks. It's just not as useful in the late stages where the deck has really been mass tested to "perfection". As for the bigger Lv 7 Dragon Rulers, I'd be fine if they all went to 2 each, as they all serve different attributes as well as their own archetype. One might be best for Tempest, but after that you should really be fine. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 04:38, June 7, 2013 (UTC)

Yeah, I mean, once the key cards of the deck get hit, other mere tech choices for the deck (like Necroface for dragon rulers) aren't as relevant anymore. Tempest is more likely than not going to be hit, mainly because it can add any dragon from your deck to your hand (most notably REDMD and LaDD). Limiting him to 1 would probably be all you need to hit the dragon rulers. Even though the deck is good, I agree it's not unbeatable. But again, just because the dragon rulers can be countered doesn't mean they shouldn't be hit by the banlist. They're still pretty hard to overcome. 98.206.70.2 (talk) 12:21, June 7, 2013 (UTC)

Pff, tier 1. What's those?

~Banned~

• Black Luster Gamebreak - Envoy of the Beginning
  • 'nuff said
• Spellbook of Judgment
  • Who doesn't love a +12? Oh, yeah, everyone that has to deal with it...
• Infestation Pandemic
  • You know, because a near-2600 beater obviously needs to be completely invincible...

~Limited~

• Super Rejuvenation
  • Easily one of the most OP cards in Dragon Rulers. You toss, summon, banish, summon, toss, destroy, toss, search, summon, toss, banish, tribute...need I go further?
• Mecha Phantom Beast Dracossack
  • An invicible boss for a tier 1 deck that can blow crap up. Seems self-explanitory to me.
• Gungnir, Dragon of the Ice Barrier
  • Kill this OP pile o' crap!
• Deep Sea Diva
  • Lets Merlanteans tap into Broken Dragon(see above). Searches out cards like Atlantean Heavy Infantry so you can summon again! YAY!
• Atlantean Dragoons
  • While we're on Merlanteans, let's kill the searcher.
• Mermail Abyssmegalo
  • I don't care how hard, but this flaming pile of garbage needs to get hit. Bad. That's all I have to say.
• Spellbook of Secrets/Spellbook Magician of Prophecy
  • Why isn't this already hit? It searches out OP garbage that no one should have to deal with.
• Blaster, Dragon Ruler of Volcanoes
  • That's a very nice ANYTHING you have there...be a shame if something...happened to it ;)
• Tempest, Dragon Ruler of Storms
  • Kill all the searchers!
• Redox, Dragon Ruler of Boulders
  • Who doesn't want to go against a deck running 4 Monster Reborns? Oh, yeah...EVERYONE!
• Tidal, Dragon Ruler of Waterfalls
  • Kill this Foolish Burial wannabe.

~Semi-Limited-

• Number 11: Big Eye
  • I really don't think he actually needs to get hit that hard, being as most(if not all) tier 1 decks run him. Since he can take another copy, who cares?
• Reactan, Dragon Ruler of Pebbles; Burner, Dragon Ruler of Sparks; Lightning, Dragon Ruler of Drafts; Stream, Dragon Ruler of Droplets
  • Let's bring out massive beaters for absolutely no cost! Plus, no one runs more than 2 anyway.

~Off List~

• Summoner Monk
  • No one runs this.
• Thunder King Rai-Oh
  • If everyone gets to search, why can't we stop them?
• T.G. Striker
  • There's better cards out there. He doesn't even really do all that much.
• Pot of Greed
  • Who cares anymore?
• Magical Stone Excavation
  • Even the few people that DO run this don't/won't run more than 2. Because it's bad, that's why.

Gem-Knight Parshath (talk • contribs) 03:54, June 10, 2013 (UTC)

Please understand that line breaks don't exactly work that way on wikia. Anyway, I highly doubt Gungnir would get hit anytime soon. If anything, Mermails, the archetype that's most likely to be running it, would be affected in such a way that the use of Gungnir would be reduced. The card itself isn't OP in comparison to its predecessor or successor, what with its Synchro Material restriction and constricted effect. --Gadjiltron (talk • contribs) 05:13, June 10, 2013 (UTC)

I know we all hate dragon rulers, but they're not going to be hit THAT hard. Either semi-limit all the big guys or just limit Tempest to 1. The mini dragon rulers and super reju probrably won't be hit as they aren't going to do much if the lv 7's get hit. Also, if the big guys get hit, people won't complain about the xyz's (Big Eye and Dragossack) either. Mermails will certainly be hit, but they likely won't have so many cards hit; if anything Dragoons and something else to 1, but not 3 or 4 cards to 1. BLS is broken, but in the current format it's not like it wins entire tournaments by itself. Sure it can win duels by itself from time to time, but otherwise, it's fine at 1. If Spellbook of Judgment gets outright banned (which I desperately want to happen), secrets and spellbook magician won't need to be hit, since without Judgment, prophecies will have no way of making massive hand setups. Why should Infestation Pandemic be hit? It's only confined to one deck and it's not the reason Evilswarms are broken, it's Rabbit that needs to go to 1. Pot of Greed defines broken. It will never come back. Summoner Monk is still a great card; it searches most key lv 4 cards in many decks. I think it's staying at 2. T.G. Striker could definitely come down, but probrably to 2 first. TKRO didn't deserve the semi-limit and it was fine at 3, but konami wanted to make more money off of prophecies. Then again, it was kinda pointless since no one ran more than 2 T-kings anyways. No one uses Magical Stone Excavation anymore, so I don't see why not to 3. 98.206.70.2 (talk) 10:59, June 10, 2013 (UTC)

Dracossack is not that hard to get over! Come on! There's many counters to Dragon Rulers like freaking Gozen Match and various other things. People side HEAVILY against the deck, so don't have worrys. Triangle format peeps <><>14:44, June 12, 2013 (UTC)><><

I know that it's not impossible to overcome Dragon Rulers, but just because a card has counters doesn't mean these counters are always available when we need them. That's the main reason Dragon Rulers must be hit. Prophecies and Mermails will also be hit somehow, since they, although possible to counter, are still doing very well competitively. (Mermails in the TCG, prophecies somewhat in the OCG). Evilswarms may be hit but they're easier to counter than the other decks so I'm not 100% sure what will happen to them. 98.206.70.2 (talk) 14:35, June 13, 2013 (UTC)

Banned: Hunkzilla25 (talk • contribs) 02:56, June 14, 2013 (UTC)

   Big eye- easy to bring out in hieratics, e dragons, mermails ect. to broken.
   evilswarm ophion- very easy to bring out and stops lv5 monsters from being summoned and all evilswarm ar like lv4 and lower.

limited:

        pot of greed- theres no point for this card to be banned like it matters people run like 3 upstart goblin anyway so yah. 
        wind-up carrier- konami just hit wind-ups to hard theres no point in banning this card and plus other decks bring out monsters easy.
        Spellbook of Judgment -Making Prophecy deck a crazy deck. Let Prophecy user almost full hand in every turn,searchable,recycle able.
        Goyo  -He is far less powerful than No.11, but i think the chance for him to unban is still low.Unless Konmai want to promote synchro again.

semi-limited

           inzektor dragonfly and inzektor hornet- inzektors really need to comeback.
 

unlimited- charge of the light brigade- just throwing it out there

         Really Summoner monk at 3? if you have 3 magic cards in your hand and 1 summoner monk that's 2 lvl 4 exceeds or a shock master, and + the hero beat deck uses summoner monk, do you rly wanna face 2-3 Excaliburs and another rank 4 exceed on the same turn? which if the bring out a shockmaster, it's game over and that's an OTK for sure, i think if anything summoner needs to be at 2, and BLSEB wont go back to banned, the deck that really uses it is the chaos dragon deck, and even then it's not overly powerful it can be easily negated and won't come back to the field. Although you are right i think the E-Dragons will be hit hard, and the spellbooks too since it can be a very quick OTK deck. Sangan might come back to 1. Eclipse wyverns, with the damage they can do might go to 2, to 1 it's really unlikely, and pot of greed is never ever coming back, if it were at 3 exodia decks would be top and they would be seen everywhere. And for my opinion and just cuz of the hatred i have towards six sams i think they need to be hit, just putting Magatama at 1 or limiting Shien's Smoke signal to 1 or 2. Karakuri's need to have their synchros at 1 as well.(190.0.96.212 (talk) 05:15, June 27, 2013 (UTC))

             six sams really need to get hit to

Inzektors are still a fairly powerful deck even with only one dragonfly and hornet. I wouldn't ease up on them so much. I don't feel Carrier Zenmaity had to be banned to hit Wind-Ups, but I have strong doubts that konami will undo something they just changed the last banlist. I'd like to see spellbook of judgment banned instead of limited because it's searchable and reusable, but limiting it is the next best thing. While Lightsworns currently aren't doing anything competitively, giving them a 2nd or 3rd charge might make them too fast. I could see Goyo Guardian coming back at some point, but it's not the best way to promote synchros and it is pretty unbalanced for a lv 6 synchro monster. 98.206.70.2 (talk) 12:39, June 14, 2013 (UTC)

Ya'll just suck at YGO. That's why you can't beat dragons. 142.59.161.172 (talk) 18:54, June 14, 2013 (UTC)

There are my thoughts (remember that konami will be do a crazy thing):

~Banned~

• Black Luster Soldier - Envoy of the Beginning
• Mind Control

~Limited~

• Super Rejuvenation
• Spellbook of Judgment
• Evilswarm Ophion
• Deep Sea Diva
• Atlantean Dragoons
• Fire Formation - Tenki
• Spellbook of Secrets
• Blaster, Dragon Ruler of Volcanoes
• Tempest, Dragon Ruler of Storms
• Redox, Dragon Ruler of Boulders
• Tidal, Dragon Ruler of Waterfalls
• Giant Trunade

~Semi-Limited-

• Royal Decree
• Maxx C
• Effect Veiler
• Macro Cosmos
• XYZ reborn

~Off List~

• Thunder King Rai-Oh

189.134.17.60 (talk) 03:09, June 18, 2013 (UTC)

Some of those hits do seem a little crazy; I doubt Konami will hit anti-meta cards like Maxx "C" or Veiler since those are some of the main answers to swarm decks. Same with Royal Decree and Macro Cosmos. They wouldn't do something like that. I also don't think they will bring back Trunade as long as Heavy Storm is legal since Trunade encourages OTK's while Heavy Storm does not. Ophion isn't going to 1 right away since that would kill Evilswarms; if anything try it at 2 first or just limit Rabbit. 98.206.70.2 (talk) 12:10, June 18, 2013 (UTC)

Banner Master

My Predictions

Banned

mecha phantom beast dracossack- dragon ruler not is blocken without he (i dont speaking english T.T)

Spellbook Of The Judgment this card is amazing from prohecy + 4or high and 1 spellcast

Limited

Blue-Eyed Maiden she +prophecy deck = gg

Deep Sea Diva

Mermail has strong this format must beat this deck

Mermail Abysslinde same of Diva

Skill Drain

with DW and Hero very strong

Semi-Limited

Big-eye same of Dracossack

Spellbook Magician of Prophecy it is heart of spellbook

Evilswarm Ophion T.T shit up ophion

Unlimited

Evigishki Gustkraken lolz hand loop on dragon ruler

E-Emergency Call not is blocken

Magical Stone Scavation

why is semi?

my predctions 179.118.203.165 (talk) 23:41, June 25, 2013 (UTC)

I don't think Blue-Eyes Maiden should be hit, mainly because consistency is an issue with Blue-eyes decks using her (it's not like the builds running her top more than regular prophecies do). I personally would like Evigishki Gustkraken and Constellar Ptolemy M7 to switch places on the banlist (M7 is the real culprit of the hand loop and several other loops), but it wouldn't be something very likely Konami would do. Skill Drain probrably won't be hit since it's a good answer to most meta decks. I don't really have any comments on the other choices. 98.206.70.2 (talk) 00:09, June 26, 2013 (UTC)

E-call was hit because it allowed HERO decks to have too much search, as HERO decks have access to Elemental HERO Stratos, Reinforcement of the Army, 2 E-Call, and 2 A Hero Lives. They can also reuse Stratos through Elemental HERO The Shining. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 01:09, June 26, 2013 (UTC)

HEROs also did top YCS San Jose this format, so they aren't really weak enough to need a 3rd E-Call. I also would personally like the lv 7 dragon rulers hit over the exceeds, but Dragossack and Big Eye ARE what bust the deck up. If they got hit dragon rulers would have to resort to other tech choices like being a good tribute or synchro engine, or go for weaker, slower rank 7's like gaia dragon or number 42. But then again, hitting Dragossack and Big Eye won't stop dragon rulers from topping, all it would do is change their focus. 98.206.70.2 (talk) 02:55, June 26, 2013 (UTC)

Plus, they can just use a few of the Rank 7 monsters we'll get in Number Hunters. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 14:25, June 26, 2013 (UTC)

The only Xyz in Number Hunters that Dragon Rulers might utilize would be Number 74: Master of Blades, and it's not quite as broken as the other ones they have already. However, the Number Wall trap card can make it a pain to take down, alongside Big Eye. While Draco and Big Eye are what allow dragon rulers to top, it doesn't necessarily mean they are the "problem", I blame the monsters that make the Xyz's so easily summonable instead of the Xyz's themselves. Dragon Rulers currently have 12 searchable, reusable, and abusable lv 7's to easily make Draco and Big Eye. I mean, even if you semi'd all 4 of the lv 7 dragon rulers or limited two of them, all of a sudden you only have 8 lv 7's to make the rank 7 exceeds instead of 12 lv 7's. The deck would still be playable like that, but not as broken as it is now. Dragon Rulers rescently won first at the WCQ's of Oceania and the Philipines. I also expect them to do well, if not top, the WCQ's of North, Central, and South America over the next two weeks as well. 98.206.70.2 (talk) 17:50, June 26, 2013 (UTC)

September Banlist 2013 Predticion #1

FORBIDDEN

(None for now)

LIMITED

• Number 11: Big Eye - Broken because of Dragon Rulers (which I think Dragon Rulers won't get hit this September yet.)

• Spellbook of Judgment - Maybe banned, but maybe they won't kill Prophecy too much.

• Super Rejuvenation - Do I have to explain?

• Gold Sarcophagus - Same comment as to Super Rejuvenation.

• Royal Oppression - Hahaha. Just Kidding. :p

• Evilswarm Ophion - Just like Legendary Six Samurai - Shi En, for me.

• Atlantean Dragoons - Broken.

• Fire Formation - Tenki - Bujin, Fire Fist, Fire King, Constellar, etc.

SEMI-LIMITED

(None for now)

UNLIMITED

(None for now)

Jampong (talk • contribs) 15:29, July 3, 2013 (UTC)

I think that Fossil Dyna Pachycephalo should be dropped to at least two. this is because they have Archlord Kristya at 2 and it is far easier to summon Fossil Dyna Pachycephalo plus if you flip it destroys all special summoned monsters on the field. if they do not Semi-limit fossil then why is Kristya Semi-limited? as for other cards yes the Dragon ruler strategy needs to get hit but the Dragons are not the problem they have balancing effects namely not being able to attack when summoned by the little ones and returning to the hand when special summoned in general. I think limiting the XYZ monsters they use is the best way to damage there playing style. yes they can replace them with other XYZ monsters but they will not be as good as what they have now. --Venom assult trooper (talk • contribs) 13:15, July 9, 2013 (UTC)

First of all, Kristya has 2800 ATK, recycles a Fairy in the grave, and puts itself back on the top of your deck when destroyed. Dyna Vs. Kristya is hardly a fair comparison. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 13:23, July 9, 2013 (UTC)

good point but Dyna still has some powerful effects. --Venom assult trooper (talk • contribs) 13:35, July 9, 2013 (UTC)

I don't think Fossil Dyna will be hit, mainly because the anti-meta decks that use it don't really do much. Some of the fairy decks that use Krystia can be quite powerful with 3 Krystia, not to mention Valhalla can summon it with no sweat. Also 2800 atk is pretty hard to run over, especially since you can't special summon. It's not hard to run over a 1200 atk monster, even when you can't special summon. As for Jampong's predictions, aside from Ophion and Big Eye going to 1, it looks ok. If you hit Rejuvenation and Gold Sarc to 1, you'll be complaining why they hit Big Eye. Evilswarms aren't very hard to counter so limiting Ophion won't happen. It would hurt the deck way too much. A semi-limit I could agree with, but not a limit. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 15:08, July 9, 2013 (UTC)

My prediction for the sep 2013 ban list is really does not hurt my current deck irun on duelingnetwork.com and in real life try harder on the next one ok

My prediction for the sept 2013 ban is that really does not hurt my current deck run on www.duelingnetwork.com and real life email or com meant me at on or [email protected] sincerely Jack292013

That's pretty much nearly every player's banlist prediction in a nutshell. "Hurt all the dominant tournament Decks unless I play it." --Gadjiltron (talk • contribs) 14:02, July 11, 2013 (UTC)

Well, I know that might not always be what Konami will do, knowing they make so much money off of the new, dominant decks, but whenever they release a new set of archetypes they want to hype up and support, by then they'll hit the old dominant decks and make people want to buy the new cards. Konami's banlist isn't meant to bring diversity to this game nor is it meant to balance this game; it's just a tool they use so they can make the most money off of the new cards they want to sell. We all have butthurt over the new decks they release, and I don't blame any of us for that, but konami won't always care so long as they're making lots of money off of these cards. The greed they have kills this game a little more each year...no offense. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 01:50, July 12, 2013 (UTC)

At least there's refuge in the occasional rogue Deck that doesn't show up in tournaments, is hardly affected by the list nowadays, but is still effective regardless of the dominating Deck. --Gadjiltron (talk • contribs) 02:43, July 12, 2013 (UTC)

My Banlist Prediction

This my ban list prediction its just the cards that I think maybe Konami will touch, not the exactly how I think the ban list should be.

Forbidden:

• BLS
• Monster Reborn

Limited:

• Spellbook of Judgment
• Rescue Rabbit

Semi-limited:

• Tidal
• Redox
• Tempest
• Blaster
• TG Striker
• Book of Moon
• Fire Formation - Tenki
• Blackwhirlwind
• One For One
• Scapegoat
• Chaos Sorcerer
• Deep Sea Diva
• Solemn Warning
• Plaguespreader Zombie
• Inzektor Dragonfly
• Lonefire Blossom
• Atlantean Dragoons

Unlimited:

• Advanced Ritual Art
• Magical Stone Excavation
• A Hero Lives
• Reasoning
• Tsukuyomi
• Debris Dragon
• Card Trooper
• Mirror Force
• Primal seed (if BLS goes Forb.)

Karmo1991 (talk • contribs) 16:48, July 12, 2013 (UTC)

Monster Reborn has been talked about for a while; I've wanted it banned for quite some time now, but I don't think Konami will ban Reborn until they design a more balanced version of it, like a spell that can special summon from only your grave, or a spell with a "discard 1 card, or pay 1000 lp" cost before you revive. But I could see them banning Reborn anyways. Most of the others look realistic (I'd trade 0 BLS for 2 Chaos Sorcerer any day; prophecies don't use Justice of Prophecy to search him, they use Justice for High Priestess). Spellbook Magician of Prophecy likely won't be hit (limiting or banning Judgment is good enough). Dragoons to 1 can call it a day for Mermails. I also think Konami will bring back one or two cards from the Forbidden list in September, as they have for almost every September banlist. But I'm not sure which one(s) will return. Last September it was Tsukuyomi and Spore. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 17:23, July 12, 2013 (UTC)

I honestly don't want to see Debris at 3 and 2 Lonefire, I'd rather just have Lonefire come down to 2, if you really want Synchros that bad. I also don't think Card Trooper should be unlimited. It either mills 3, or lets you draw one. I'm also not sure if I want to see PLZ at 2, but Striker at 2 might be alright. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 18:03, July 13, 2013 (UTC)

As long as Lonefire can summon Tyntannial, Princess of Camellias by itself, I'd rather not have it at 2. Scapegoat is pretty good for most Synchro and stall decks, but it hasn't seen much play, even in Phantom Beast Plane decks, so I could possibly see it at 2. Debris at 3 I could see, most dragon ruler and synchro decks lately haven't ran Debris, and even if it was unlimited, I doubt many decks would use 3 anyways. The only issue I see with Card Trooper is Machine Duplication, which might make it too powerful at 3. It's been a while since Inzektors have topped, but they're a fairly powerful deck even with only one dragonfly, and 2 dragonfly might be all you need to catapult Inzektors up to tier 1.5 or even tier 1. T.G. Agents haven't done anything for a while now, so 2 T.G. Striker won't do any harm. The problem with Book of Moon is it's too abusive at 2 or 3. Konami learned this in 2009/2010 when everyone ran 3 Book of Moon and whoever drew them earliest almost always won. Abusive cards that everyone uses end up getting limited or banned, even though it can also be used against you. Because of Book of Moon's great utility and splashability, I'd personally like to see it stay at 1. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 20:22, July 13, 2013 (UTC)

Well, they might semi-limit Lonefire, mostly because of Thalia, Princess of Cherry Blossoms and Marina, Princess of Sunflowers. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 16:16, July 14, 2013 (UTC)

I suppose new plant support might justify Lonefire going to 2, but that might also boost old Plant Synchro decks quite a bit. There also is new Zombie support coming out soon, but in the same manner with Lonefire, that might not completely justify Mezuki going to 2, but I could see some old decks like that getting a boost this upcoming format. Last September it was for BW's, not too sure this September. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 22:03, July 14, 2013 (UTC)

Ninety-eight Thanks for your opinions, but about your "Debris at 3 and 2 Lonefire" commentary, I already told, before I mention the list, that this prediction its just what Konami maybe touch, not exactly how I think its should be. Of course I also think that Lone at 2 and Debris at 3 will probably not happen, just maybe 1 of them.

Karmo1991 (talk • contribs) 11:48, July 16, 2013 (UTC)

Karmo, we understand that those were only what you thought could be hit, but all we're doing is inputting our opinions on what some of those possible changes could mean for the game. We aren't trying to say that's exactly what you want. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 13:32, July 16, 2013 (UTC)

Yeah, now I get it. I just thought, when Ninety-eight mention "I honestly don't want to see Debris at 3 and 2 Lonefire", that he was comparing both their banlist position. It's ok now. After all this are just predictions and opinions.

Karmo1991 (talk • contribs) 14:30, July 16, 2013 (UTC)

True, I didn't want both at once. I could see either happen, but 2 Lonefire and 3 Debris could make old plants a bit too good. Then again, if Konami is making new plants, as Ace mentioned, they might bring Lonefire down to support them. Not that it's a gurantee but it may happen. And even though Rulers and Prophecy will be hit in September, we can't forget to nerf Mermails alongside them, as they'll be topping if D-Rulers and Prophecy are slowed down, and Konami doesn't make money off of Mermails anymore. They might have not done much to the OCG knowing Rulers and Prophecy are dominating over there, but Mermails did dominate the TCG this format (4 YCS's), and they'll keep dominating in September unless they get hit also. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 17:41, July 16, 2013 (UTC)

Ace's Predictions

Forbidden

• Nothing that strikes me as needing a Forbidden status.

Limited

• Spellbook of Judgment
• Atlantean Dragoons

Semi-Limited

• Tidal, Redox, Blaster, and Tempest
• T.G. Striker
• Mermail Abysslinde - Searches out the Abysspike and Abyssturge
• Fire Formation - Tenki
• Spellbook of Secrets
• Black Whirlwind - If this comes down to 2, Kault should go back to 2.

Unlimited

• Thunder King Rai-Oh
• Tsukuyomi
• Advanced Ritual Art
• Magical Stone Excavation

That's what I'd like to see. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 03:31, July 16, 2013 (UTC)

No hits to Mermails? =( Otherwise, that looks good. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 17:32, July 16, 2013 (UTC)

Ahh, that's what I was forgetting. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 17:56, July 16, 2013 (UTC)

We haven't seen Mermails in favor after D-Rulers and Prophecies after LTGY. Why do you think they'll be hit? ladycai (talk • contribs) 15:03, July 17, 2013 (UTC)

Before Rulers and Judgment came out, Mermails were a top deck in the TCG (Topped in 4 Yu-Gi-Oh! Championship Series, usually winning the tournament), and if they aren't hit in September, then they'll start to top tournaments in the next format. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 16:06, July 17, 2013 (UTC)

That, and Konami doesn't make money off of Mermails anymore. If Dragon Rulers and Prophecies get hit in September, Mermails will continue to dominate tournaments in the TCG unless they get hit also. Mermails are just behind Dragon Rulers and Prophecies as being the 3rd best deck as of now. Don't ease up on Mermails just because Dragon Rulers and Prophecies are better. They need to get hit too. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 19:05, July 17, 2013 (UTC)

My 2 Cents

Forbidden

Super Rejuvenation: Dragons are a powerful deck even without the ability to draw 2/4 cards every turn, which no legal deck should have the power of doing. On the off-chance you draw more than 1 super rejuv, including drawing during the end phase, you get to stack the amount. Too good. (This wouldn't be a problem if was inconsistent, but it's consistent as hell.)

Limited

Spellbook Judgment Day and Spellbook Magician of Prophecy: These 2 at 1, to keep the decks explosiveness in check. Don't feel the need to ban them because of all the prophecy counters coming out in the near future, and because gateway and shi-en, dragonfly and hornet became fair after their limitations.

Sinister Serpent: This card is not as much as a threat as it ways many years ago, like tsukuyomi.

Magician of Faith: Same as sinister serpent, and because prophecy are not nearly as powerful to abuse it anymore.

Semi-Limited

Atlantean Dragoons and Abyssphere: Mermails have a lot of power, but it becomes deadly when they have the consistency to back it up. Dragoons and the trap card make it too easy for them to sack, but it's not as big a problem as books or dragons. (but having mermails get off scott-free wouldn't change much.)

Fire Formation - Tenki: This is a powerful card, but like rota, it went to 2 before going to 1, mostly to promote warrior types. With Konami promoting fire fists and the new "bujin" monsters, which rely on this, they probably won't take away the card that makes them playable. But too good to pass up nonetheless.

All level 7 Dragon Ruler monsters: When it comes to d-ruler hits, most people want dracossack and big eye on the list for their power, but they're only powerful because of the cards that make them that way. Having the "mega" d-rulers semi-limited drastically slows down the deck, making the babies not as live and making you think more before gold sarc'ing. This also makes them what they were originally intended for, without making them useless; supporting weaker attribute decks.

Rai-oh and Tsukuyomi will stay Semi'd because of they're generic power.

ExplodiaNecross (talk • contribs) 19:47, July 19, 2013 (UTC)

I could probably see Rejuvenation going to 1 first, but I wouldn't be entirely surprised if Konami bans it, since all it really does is reward over-extension for Hieratics and Dragon Rulers. I was skeptical of unbanning MoF earlier, but now I actually agree very much on unbanning Magician of Faith. It's just too slow for the current meta, especially being a flip-effect monster (It'd be pretty obvious if someone set it...they'd blow it up before it's flipped more likely than not). It's also not like everyone would be willing to even run an inconsistent card like that. Same goes for Sinister Serpent, who I've wanted back for years now. Mermails definitely can't go free for another list, but they shouldn't get over-killed either. Tsukuyomi and T-King may stay at 2, but I still haven't seen anyone run Tsukuyomi since it was unbanned last September (or maybe it's just me not getting lucky enough to see play from that card), and I still haven't seen anyone run more than 2 T-Kings anyways. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 23:27, July 19, 2013 (UTC)

My prediction (update)

Banned

Mind Control - New Synchros in Judgment of the Light

Limited

Sinister Serpent - Too slow

Atlantean Dragoons - Mermail/Atlantean needs to get hit

Rescue Rabbit - Slows down rabbit base decks and Evilswarms

Super Rejuvenation - Too much advantage with Dragon Ruler

Spellbook of Judgment - Same as Super Rejuvenation except for Prophecy

Fire Formation - Tenki - Slows down fire fist

E - Emergency Call - Heros still have too much search even at 2

Abyss-sphere - A very annoying card with Mermail Abysslinde

Semi-limited

Blaster, Dragon Ruler of Infernos, Redox, Dragon Ruler of Boulders, Tempest, Dragon Ruler of Storms, Tidal, Dragon Ruler of Waterfalls - Dragon Rulers need to get hit

Dark Armed Dragon - To tell the truth, he is not as good anymore as he used to be since most of the support that made his deck build good are either limited or banned, not to mention the metagame has gotten to fast for him. besides he is not really doing anything to the meta.

Gladiator Beast Bestiari - Gladiator beast arent doing anything

Plaguespreader Zombie - Not really as good as it used to be

T.G. Striker - T.G. Agents arent doing anything

Mermail Abysslinde - Free mermail upon any destruction on the field

Formula Synchron - Not really good anymore with all the good level 1 tuners banned

Book of Moon - Top Decks dont run this card much anymore, not as popular as it used to be

One For One - No one really uses this card

Scapegoat - Stalling isnt popular anymore in the current meta, also Mecha Phantom Beast need more token support

The Transmigration Prophecy - No one uses this card

Unlimited

Debris Dragon - No one uses this card

Tsukuyomi - Same as Debris

Advanced Ritual Art - Rituals arent doing anything

Magical Stone Excavation - Same as Debris

Reasoning - Same As Debris

Mirror Force - Alot of boss monsters in the meta are immune to this card, also this card gets destroyed before the battle phase even starts. people might not run more than 2 anywayGuardian Skunk (talk • contribs) 08:23, July 24, 2013 (UTC)

I think the Forbidden and Limited sections are fairly justified, but I think E-Call should be left at 2. HERO decks haven't really done that much in major tournaments. As for Glad. Beast Bestiari, he should be left at 1. It's too easy to abuse him with Elemental HERO Prisma (Searchable by E-Call, RotA, Stratos, and A Hero Lives) and Gladiator Beast Gyzarus, and limiting E-Call wouldn't stop that. I think it's too risky to semi-limit DAD, he's still easy to use in Chaos Dragons, but he might not be too bad. It's kinda odd that you want both Formula Synchron and One for One back to 2, I think both at the same time is just asking for trouble, also the only deck that used Formula Synchron and One for One was plant decks, and I'd rather not have them with Melia the Ashwood Nymph, too much Spore reuse. Book of Moon is one of those cards that Konami has tried at 2 in the past, and what usually happens is people always run it, making it go back to Limited Status. The Transmigration Prophecy recycles itself as well, so it'll probably stay at one. Not sure I'd want Debris at 3 with Plants still a contender for next format. That's what my thoughts are. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 17:09, July 23, 2013 (UTC)

I think you over-hit Mermails with your list, Dragoons and either Linde or Sphere can get hit, but Limiting Dragoons, Sphere, and semi-ing Linde is too much hurt on Mermails. Limit Dragoons and Semi-limit either Linde or Sphere and Mermails are good. Scapegoat may be like Book of Moon, it's a good card to make synchros in synchro decks, but I'm not sure if it would be too good at 2 or 3. E-Call to 1 is a possibility, but HERO decks aren't a dominant deck as of now, sure they won a YCS this format but otherwise E-Call is fine at 2. The Transmigration Prophecy is limited because 1) it loops itself at more than 1, and 2) there was a stall deck in the OCG using D.D. Borderline that topped a lot when Transmigration was at 3. I agree with everything unlimited and most of the other Semi-limits, except I would pick either Formula or One for one to come down to 2, not both at once. Same with Dad and Plaguespreader, one or the other could come down, but both at once might make Tele-Dad a thing again. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 18:31, July 23, 2013 (UTC)

While I agree that the new splashable Synchros in JOTL might make Mind Control more widely-used, they're not so terribly gamebreaking that they'd appear everywhere. The Extra Deck still has finite space, and they have to compete with Xyz Monsters as well, so even at times the mighty Celestial Dragon has to sit out a duel because its effects can't quite match up to the other options present. If Mind Control would get banned, it's most likely for a reason other than the new Synchros. --Gadjiltron (talk • contribs) 01:20, July 25, 2013 (UTC)

Maybe they'll ban Mind Control if they want to promote newer cards that gain control of monsters. The only difference between Mind Control and Change of Heart is you can't attack with or tribute the monster. You can use it for anything else. In the same way, they might ban Pot of Avarice if they want to sell Pot of Duplicity from Shadow Specters, which is a watered-down version of Avarice. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 03:24, July 25, 2013 (UTC)

Maybe, but I think the fact is that Avarice was only really hit so Synchro decks couldn't use 2-3 copies of it to keep on reusing their monsters. Even if Avarice is hit, Duplicity is still good enough, and many Synchrocentric decks run more than 2-3 types of monster. For example, most of them have a Plant engine, a Tour Guide/Crane Crane, and something from the Extra deck like T.G Hyper Librarian. Even if Avarice goes away, trading a Battle Phase to draw two more cards from your deck and reuse your best cards is still a very good deal. Duplicity is "fairer", but not hard to use, and the Battle Phase skip isn't a big deal with a good field of Synchro monsters. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 03:41, July 25, 2013 (UTC)

I guess Konami could ban it if they're trying to promote a replacement for it (like Harpie's Feather Duster --> Heavy Storm, Raigeki --> Dark Hole, or Pot of Greed --> A million other cards that let you draw 2, but with a cost). Avarice is a bit more splashable than Duplicity as well, which could make it more likely to be banned (Mermails, Wind-Ups, Fire Fists, Machina Gadgets use Avarice too), but Duplicity would be harder to use than Avarice knowing they rely heavily on 1-2 types of monster or so. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 06:39, July 25, 2013 (UTC)

My predictions (Update)

Banned:

• (Maybe) Reborn, Avarice, or Mind Control.

Limited:

• Atlantean Dragoons - Hits Mermails.
• (Maybe) Rescue Rabbit - If you insist on hitting Evilswarms do this.
• Sinister Serpent - Too slow for the current meta.
• Super Rejuvenation - Hits D-rulers.
• Spellbook of Judgment - Hits Prophecy.

Semi-Limited:

• T.G. Striker - T.G. Agents could use a boost.
• Gold Sarcophagus - Another hit to D-Rulers.
• (Maybe) Tidal, Redox, Blaster, and Tempest - If Super Reju and Gold Sarc are left untouched, do this instead.
• (Maybe) Fire Formation - Tenki - Fire Fists might need to slow down a little bit, but Konami might leave this untouched until next March if they want to promote the bujin war gods this upcoming format.

Unlimited:

• Thunder King Rai-Oh - No one ran more than 2 anyways.
• Tsukuyomi - It'll always be trash so long as Time Seal is banned.
• Advanced Ritual Art - No one really uses ritual decks anymore.
• Magical Stone Excavation - No one runs this card, and even if it does get unlimited, the few people who do run it probrably wouldn't use 3 anyways.
• Reasoning - This card and Turbo OTKs aren't relevant to the current meta, and the key card to the OTK with Reasoning (Magical Explosion) is limited.
• Mirror Force - Many people have dropped this card since it's so easy to get around. And I doubt anyone would use 3 anyways.

Those are my (updated) predictions. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 01:23, July 30, 2013 (UTC)

Not what i want,but what sounds fair...

Ban(IMO)

• 1)Big eye
• 2)Dragossack
• 3)Spell book of judgement
• 4)Dark hole
• 5)Heavy Storm
• 6)Maxx -C
• 7)Mind Control

Limit

• 1)various of the mermail/atlantean
• 2)tenki
• 3)Infistation(or whatever is called)
• 4)Torrential tribbute
• 5)Mirror force
• 6)Searchers of e-dragons.
• 7)Goyo(yeap)
• 8)Various Spellbooks
• 9)Breakthrough skill
• 10)Kerykeion

Semi limit

• 1)E-dragons
• 2)one for one
• 3)Gale the whirlwind(yeap)
• 4)Black Whirlwind(yeap)
• 5)t.g striker.

Ok... Analysis... ban: 1)Cost:2 cards and you get a monster on field.That's minus 1.Effect,you get a monster from the opponent.That' 2 for 2.The opponent looses a monster.that's 2 for 3. 2)Pretty much the same with above and is almost immortal. 3)a plus 5 from searching and adding i think is to much. 4)Partial screen nuke 5)Same with above 6)1 for how many ever sounds unfair. Limit 1)They can go pretty crazy. 2)Why rota and not tenki? 3)recycling with immunity is ok when done properly and not spamming. 4/5)One for a lot may hurt. 6)it breaks down the consistency of an overpowered deck. 7)True...he is a punisher.Though it's a synchro and it costs minimum 2 cards,excepte from blackwings and dandlyion combos etc. 8)Some of the "gadgets" in the toolbox are overpowered.To me even spellbook of power is extreme. 9)one card targeting two.meaning it will eventually take eff in grave. 10)Broken.. Semi limit: 1)just because they are usefull in other decks. 2)The cost is ok and bulb will never return. 3)For the shake of blackwings..i know he is kinda broken.. 4)why wind up factory at 3 and not semilimited black whirlwind? 5)Just for the t.g archtype.honor them.

I know..this ban list may sound weird.But let's check it. 1)Most of these cards go ++. 2)konami supports again the synchro game with new synchros. 3)goyo i must admit is damn good but as i said the cost is 2 cards(most of the times) and it must attack to take effect. 4)I want to believe that the game will be kinda balanced for a period and give the chance to old themes/archtypes to get back strong.

Where do i base all that?Personally i am into TCG since 2004.The game changed radically at 2005 with the goat control deck,started to become insane with DDT(Diamond Dude Turbo),got broken with dad return/tele dad,Got back to balance with cat synchro and off it went back to broken with initial version of legendary six samurais and tengu plant and the various plant versions e.g junk doppel etc. One main difference with all these decks that i already mentioned and the ones that are currently on top tiers. Even the fact that junk doppel could go up to + a lot,it was a random draw.just drawing cards that could be pretty much useless and may be used as bluffing the opponent.now...spellbooks,firefists,mermails,wind ups,inzectors,e-dragons,even madolches which from what i hear is pretty much ok,they will Add for nothing. Those who have been into statistics,posibilities or gumbling are aware of the fact that a casino in roulett plays with a handicap of 2.5% and you just cant win. What does that mean??Lady luck is a factor in the game and she should be given a chance again.

As for formula synchron that somebody mentioned above..going for black rose in opponents end of main phase could mean 2 for a lot more.. Infernalblast (talk • contribs) 02:13, August 1, 2013 (UTC)

Your F&L list is whack. It's just too unfair, not fair. If you ban Big Eye and Dragosack (Which Won't Happen), then you have no reason to hit the E-Drags, plus they can just make Number 74: Master of Blades, who can't be targeted, so the only way to kill it is Dark Hole, Mirror Force, or Torrential Tribute (Which are harder to draw with only 1 copy). Also with Heavy Storm gone, you encourage overextending and horrible plays from players. Also with no fear of Heavy Storm, people just set 5 traps and if you go second, you're going to most likely lose. Maxx "C" is an anti-meta card, it's a deterrent so people don't try to special summon a bunch of monsters, so it's either a -1 or 1-1 trade if the opponent doesn't make more special summons, not to mention you only draw more if the opponent pushes and continues making Special Summons. If you ban Judgment, then there's no reason to hit any other Spellbook, maybe Secrets to 2, but that's really all. Goyo is too good for a Level 6, it has the same attack as Scrap Dragon, but it's easier to get the levels for it. Not to mention it does the same thing Big Eye does (According to your reasoning for why Big Eye should be banned, it's still a "2-3" trade). Evilswarms won't be hit, they only reason they see play is as an anti-meta deck that has good games against E-Drag and Prophecy, they'll probably lose favor depending on what happens in September. Breakthrough Skill is another Anti-Meta card, it's also much like Effect Veiler/Fiendish Chain, just reusable on your turn to stop some effects like Wind-Up Zenmaines. Tenki might not get hit, Konami might leave it alone for 3-Axis Fire Fist and Bujin in the TCG. I'd rather Gale stay at one, it's a reusable Shrink, 3 Level (Crane Crane), and it Special Summons itself.

I wasn't trying to be mean or anything, but what you think is "fair" just takes us back in time to 2009-2010. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 02:33, August 1, 2013 (UTC)

This is more of a wishlist than a realistic banlist. Big Eye AND Dracosack banned? Are you really that much butthurt over dragon rulers? Hit the lv 7 dragon rulers that make big eye and dracosack so easily summonable (Or ban/limit super rejuv and Gold Sarc), not big eye and dracosack themselves. Goyo Guardian is not coming back anytime soon, if ever. It's atk is way too high for a lv 6 synchro monster with no tuner restrictions and its effect is broken as hell. Heavy Storm and Dark Hole are necessary evils in the game, to punish stupid over-extension plays. Torrential and Mirror Force to 1? Do you hate cards that punish over-extension that much? Mirror Force can go to 3, and Torrential is fine at 2. Maxx C and the Evilswarm archetype will not be touched since they are anti-meta cards that discourage swarming and stop high-level swarm decks, respectively. That, and when D-rulers and Mermails get slowed down next format, Evilswarms will see almost no play at all. Blackwings could get another boost, but 2 Whirlwind and 2 Gale? One or the other is possible, but not both at once. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 07:05, August 1, 2013 (UTC)

Potential Leak?

I found this earlier today which could be a possible leak on the September banlist. This is by no means guranateed to be real, and neither is this the entire September banlist, but it says at least this:

Banned:

• Super Rejuvenation
• Card Destruction

Limited:

• Atlantean Dragoons
• Thunder King Rai-Oh

Semi-Limited:

• Blackwing - Gale the Whirlwind
• One for One

Unlimited:

• The Agent of Mystery - Earth
• Hieratic Seal of Convocation

This is mere speculation as of now, but something worth mentioning. I doubt most of this is real anyways... Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 17:06, August 2, 2013 (UTC)

It's probably fake. I don't see Prophecy anywhere on that list, and Thunder King Rai-Oh to one seems like crazy talk. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 23:26, August 2, 2013 (UTC)

Well, like I said, that's not the full list and it definitely isn't confirmed. I personally think it's fake myself, just posted it as a heads up, more leaks will come out from here on out until the real banlist is put up on shriek in two weeks or so. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 23:29, August 2, 2013 (UTC)

It's definitely fake. The top-left corner on the image says March 1, 2013, not September 1, 2013.--Perfect Sige (talk • contribs) 06:38, August 7, 2013 (UTC)

Yeah I think it's fake too. TKRO to 1 alone is proof of that. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 13:03, August 7, 2013 (UTC)

Spellbook of Judgment? why not Secrets instead?

I noticed that almost everyone wants Spellbook of Judgment to be hit. Some explanations above clearly believed that Judgment won't be that significant.
But what about Spellbook of Secrets? I gotta say that card would make a highly significant change if it gets Limited or even Banned.
They'll lose some search power for sure, but they still have the DRAW power right?
What do you think guys?
Bijak riyandi (talk • contribs) 03:25, August 3, 2013 (UTC) [edit 03:36, August 3, 2013 (UTC)]

Spellbook of Secrets and Spellbook Magician of Prophecy shouldn't be hit because they aren't problem cards for prophecy. Those cards are the key cards for the deck. Judgment is the problem card at hand, and prophecies don't need it to be a deck, they need it to be a great deck. Even if Judgment gets limited or banned, the deck will still be alive but not broken as hell. Limiting or banning Secrets or Spellbook Magician kills the deck. Even if Judgment goes unpunished, the deck cannot function properly without secrets or spellbook magician. That, and it's not like Konami to kill a deck they're trying to profit off of. They'll probrably slow the deck down by hitting judgment, and not kill it by limiting secrets and/or magician. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 03:56, August 3, 2013 (UTC)

And 2 to 3 formats later, then they choose to kill it, provided it's been sticking around for too long. --Gadjiltron (talk • contribs) 08:20, August 3, 2013 (UTC)

Hitting the search cards would not kill Prophecy. Hitting Spellbook of Fate and possibly Spellbook Star Hall... That would kill them. Who cares about all the searching if the cards you search can't accomplish anything? Battlemaniac (talk • contribs) 10:43, August 3, 2013 (UTC)

They're still promoting prophecies atm, so they definitely won't kill them in September. But I wouldn't be surprised if they die in March or so, when they don't make much off of the deck anymore. And yes, limiting Secrets and Spellbook Magician IS overkill for the deck. Limiting or banning Judgment does not kill the deck at all, it just slows it down. The searchers are everything for Prophecy. Secrets and Spellbook Magician add Fate, Star Hall, Power, ect, alongside Judgment, the win button for the deck. The deck has no competitve consistency if Secrets/Spellbook Magician are limited or banned (not counting Judgment, since they don't NEED that). (sorry, I had a seperate account for another wiki) Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 14:58, August 3, 2013 (UTC)

Thoughts on the ban list

Thoughts on the ban list

Decided to give my opinion on what might hit the ban list and why. I'm alittle new at this, so bare with me. Here goes nothing...

Banned:

Big eye- instantly steal a monster at the cost of not attacking? Who doesn't think this should be banned (besides mecha phantom beast and dragon ruler players)

Evilswarm bahamut- 2350 big eye minus the restriction

Mind control- this card makes so many instant xyz summons that it is rediculous. taking this out might even the playing field alittle. Kind of a longshot though...

spellbook of judgement- get spellbook card of your choice (except itself) for every spell card used? it makes prophecy decks extremely OP. pretty sure this will either end up here or on the limited section (I lean more towards the banned section)

Limited:

super rejuvenation- I feel the same way about this card as I do judgement. since you draw cards though I don't think it will get as much hate as the other card though

fire formation tenki- Rota for beast warriors

Abysslinde & Megalo- limit these and Mermails can't get too many of their effects off so easily. stop the Mermails and any Atlanteans they got can't get too many of their effects off so easily. enough said

tempest & tidal- tempest is an searcher and tidal is a foolish burial. add this with any big dragon effect and you have the reason why imperial iron wall is $8

Dracossack- very good in dragon rulers, can survive anything if tokens are on field, and pops cards at the cost of a token.

spellbook of secrets- this is the searcher for the deck. it gets monsters, spells, if it has spellbook or prophecy in its name, this can get it.

spellbook of the master- copy a spellbook normal spell card effect? ask yourself this: do you really wanna play prophecys knowing that they can have up to six spellbook of secrets in their deck

spellbook of fate- banish a card; this card does not target. Either ban this or limit this.

semi-limit:

infestation pandemic- Oh how I hate this card. If ophion's lockdown of level 5 and higher monsters wasn't broken enough for you, he can search for this card and uses it become immune to your spell and traps for a turn. if that ain't bad enough for you, all his evilswarm friends on the field also get immunity. this card sparks so many lance wars in my locals it is ridiculous.

Solem Warning- Konami, if you were gonna create E-dragons why on earth did you limit this card? Well lets say you don't mind dragon rulers then look at it from the hieratic point of view. hieratics are essentially the first dragon rulers. if you build your deck right and if your opponent doesn't know what to hit, you can almost always get an otk. E-dragons and hieratics do ridiculous amounts of special summons and both have many ways of clearing your backrow, so putting this at 2 again gives us more firepower against those guys

off the list:

summoner monk(3)- no help this format (can be good for the dino-ninjas though)

glow-up bulb (1)- if debris dragon doesn't go to 3 then this could go to limited. with the current meta, junks and lightsworns are gonna need some firepower just to stay competitive. on the other hand this could make e-dragons stronger as well (quick 8 syncro summons and the nil), so I don't know...

mirror force(3)- E-dragons don't care, evilswarms get immunity, prophecys get immunity, Dracossack get's immunity; my point is that this card does not put in work like it used to

D-prison(3)- same excuse as mirror force

outside of these cards, I don't see too much changing on the list.

Giokayne (talk • contribs) 08:01, August 4, 2013 (UTC)

Summoner Monk is probrably going to stay at 2; it can create otk's at 2 if used right and if it was at 3 it would be too powerful when combined with certain cards. D-Prison is already unlimited...lol. As for Mermails, Linde or Megalo could get hit, but Dragoons is probrably a bigger problem since it can add any Sea-Serpent. I'm not sure about Glow-Up Bulb; I'm honestly on the fence about it returning and many people could've cared less if it was or wasn't banned last year. You're a little too harsh on Prophecy; banning Judgment would be enough to stop them. Secrets, Master, and Fate don't need to be hit if Judgment is banned. Evilswarm Bahamut is actually more fair than not since it has a discard, it's only good for evilswarms, and it's only for face-up monsters. You could smack the Rabbit if you want to hit Evilswarms or you could just leave them alone, since they'll be less powerful next format when Bujins and Fire Fists rise up. Tenki might go to 1, but since Konami is promoting the new Bujin archetype, they might semi it first or wait 'till March to hit it. Big Eye becomes less relevant if you hit the lv 7 dragon rulers themselves (like you said, Tidal and Tempest); once that happens, the deck will not be able to summon Big Eye and Dracossack every turn. Limiting or Banning Super Rejuvenation would also smack them pretty hard. Also, Konami will make more broken rank 7's in the future anyways; they most rescently came out with Number 74: Master of Blades, and he's just the first of what will be many more. Therefore hitting Dracossack and Big Eye is almost useless since it won't stop them from finding a way to top. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 14:10, August 4, 2013 (UTC)

My Predicion

Banned:

- Number 11: Big Eye (oh look I don't have Goyo...well I don't care anymore)
- Mind Control (Actually...this might not get hit)
- Super Rejuvenation (Cause everybody loves a +4...and why not? another +4 at the end phase)
- Spellbook of Judgment (Search, summon, banish, return, rinse and repeat)

Limited:

- Rescue Rabbit (Been around too long and extremely splashable)
- Atlantean Dragoons
- Mecha Phantom Beast Draccosack (Trigger happy boss monster)
- Evilswarm Ophion (Really?)
- Fire Formation - Tenki
- Spellbook of Power

Semi-Limited:

- Effect Veiler
- Mermail Abysslinde
- The 4 Dragon rulers
- Black whirlwind (nobody cares anymore)
- Gateway of the six (nobody cares anymore)
- Infestation Pandemic
- Solemn Warning

No longer limited:

- Tsukuyomi
- Mirror Force

I don't think the e-dragons will get directly limited, since the collector tins feature them, it would mean big loss for konami sales to try and sell a deck nobody want to use anymore. It would be "wiser" economically speaking to wiat till march and hit them hard after all the tins got sold out (better kill those splashable boss monsters), that would bring no balance to the game...but who cares? konami care for the shinniez.

Funny how Big Eye's been around for nearly two years now but nobody seemed to mind it until this format. Where was all the fuss before E-Dragons came into the scene? Should you injure the E-Drags and their LV7 engine, Big Eye's presence on the tournament scene should be largely reduced. Same applies with Draccosack. --Gadjiltron (talk • contribs) 09:52, August 4, 2013 (UTC)

Banning Spellbook of Judgment is all you need to do to hit prophecy; spellbook of power is fine at 3 if Judgment gets banned. The Dragon Rulers themselves aren't going to be hit that hard since they're so new, so the best way to go would be to limit/ban super rejuvenation and maybe smack gold sarc alongside that so their search power is down. Hitting the rank 7's they make is pointless. It won't stop the deck from topping and Konami will just make more broken rank 7's in the future anyways (most rescently Number 74: Master of Blades). Therefore Big Eye and Dracossack likely won't be touched. Ophion's prescence on the battlefield will be greatly reduced once Dragon Rulers, Prophecies, and Mermails get slowed down, because by then Bujins and 3-axis Fire Fists will begin to rise up; also limiting Rabbit would slow down Evilswarms enough. Also, since Konami will be promoting Bujins in the brand-new JOTL and Shadow Specters sets, they probrably won't hit Tenki until March, or they could semi-limit it this upcoming format. Veiler has no reason to be semi-limited; it's a perfectly fine anti-swarm card like Maxx "C" that can stay at 3. I can agree with Blackwings getting a 2nd Black Whirlwind or Gale the Whirlwind, but Six Sams are still a fairly solid deck; they will not ever get a 2nd Gateway. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 14:12, August 4, 2013 (UTC)

Link's picks

Banned

Mind Control: i take your monster for free to make my own strong monster. Free steal to annoying

Limited

Sinister serpent: what good would it do in the current meta. Just let us have it back to test it

Dragged down to the grave: dark worlds, enough said. Set 4 Barstow and use dragged down. O look u can choose Silvia or grapha and ill look at your hand for free an discard heavy storm. No

Super rejuvenation: e dragons are already to fast to furious. No reason that they should summon a full field then draw 4 cards and pull another and draw 4 more.

Spellbook of judgement: this card is just to OP to keep at 3 and with how much SB can search for cards and put some back in hand or deck this card can be recycled easy even at 1.

Number 11: big eye: come on its big eye. Enough said there. Semi-limited

SB of fate: this card has to many options and to top it all off it doesn't target. Really

The 4 baby e dragons: if your like me the moment u see the opponent drop a baby u wanna scoop to side in gozen and vanity or even Victoria. Since the daddy dragons can search any other element there is no need for so many.

Tell me what u all think

Fate maybe at a semi-limit, but you could also semi Secrets to prevent searching. Not sure if Big Eye really has to go, it seems more effective to hit E-Drags and Mermails to slow down them making Big Eye. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 13:41, August 6, 2013 (UTC)

I don't think Dragged Down will be hit, mainly because Dark Worlds aren't doing much on a competitive level atm since they're so easy to side against. I'd like to see Rejuvenation and/or Judgment banned instead of limited (especially Judgment since it's searchable), but limiting them is better than nothing and more likely for now. Semi-limiting the daddy d-rulers would probably be more effective than semi-ing the baby's or limiting Big Eye since most builds only need 2 of each baby and you only need one big eye to steal a monster. I could see Fate going to 2, and I agree on Mind Control and Sinister Serpent. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 14:17, August 6, 2013 (UTC)

My Predictions

OK, here are my predictions:

Forbidden

Elemental HERO Stratos - i still think heroes have too much search power

Mind Control - leads to an easy synchro or xyz summon

Spellbook of Judgment - even at 1 it can be searchable and recycled

Limited

Rescue Rabbit - still pretty powerful at 2

Sinister Serpent - could be worth experimenting at 1

Atlantean Dragoons - can search any sea serpent like Mermail Abyssmegalo

Super Rejuvenation - whatever happens to the main Dragon Rulers, this should be limited

Fire Formation - Tenki - RotA for Beast-Warriors, OP with Fire Fists

Semi-Limited

all 4 LV7 Dragon Rulers - since they will appear in the upcoming tins, they would probably get semi'd at max

Black Whirlwind - i don't think this will bring Blackwings back to top tier

Mermail Abysslinde - can bring out any mermail

Unlimited

Debris Dragon - maybe Konami will want to promote the return of synchro monsters?

The Agent of Mystery - Earth - i don't think this will bring Agents to top tier

Thunder King Rai-Oh - why was this semi-limited in the first place?

Tour Guide From the Underworld - with sangan gone, maybe she can move off the list?

Hieratic Seal of Convocation - i don't think this will bring Hieratics to top tier

Pot of Duality - this should help many weaker decks, plus the no-special-summoning restriction makes it balanced enough to me

Magical Stone Excavation - don't think anyone uses this

--Moja619 (talk • contribs) 02:55, August 7, 2013 (UTC)

I agree with everything on this list except for Stratos, Convocation, and Tenki. I think HEROs could take another blow to their searchers, maybe 1 E-Call or 1 HERO lives, but banning Stratos is murdering the deck. Hieratics are still a fairly solid OTK deck and they don't need a third Convocation (although it wouldn't entirely surprise me), and since Konami will promote Bujins next format, Tenki will more likely be at 2 first, or untouched until March. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 13:07, August 7, 2013 (UTC)

My Predictions

forbidden

Spellbook for judgement (If not harder to make money off of newer decks, also leaves it so they can still push the deck if they want.)

Eradicator Epidemic Virus (I smell crush card all over again and making crazy box did it in otherwise I wouldn't even have it on this list.)

limited

Super Rejuvenation(Consistency check on Dragon Rulers.)

Burner, Dragon Ruler of Sparks (these made the deck a problem and o they won't have to hit the big dragons)

Lightning, Dragon Ruler of Drafts(^)

Reactan, Dragon Ruler of Pebbles(^)

Stream, Dragon Ruler of Droplets(^)

Atlantean Dragoons(make sure format isn't pre LTGY)

Evilswarm Ophion(to promote synchros. personally I don't want an evilswarm hit, but could happen)

Gold Sarcophagus(Consistency check on Dragon Rulers and Rabbit decks. may not happen or may end up semi limited instead.)

I think one card will come back from forbidden status, but not sure which.

semi Limited

Mezuki (promotes new zombies, isn't too much anymore)

Plaugespreader Zombie (promotes new zombies and synchros)

Burial from a Different Dimension (Just a feeling)

T.G. Striker (promotes synchro)

Unlimited

Tsukuyomi (I think the trend of moving it down will continue, either way no one will care.)

Tragoedia (Possibly to help slower decks.)

Don't see a fire fist hit happening this list.--Sometimes the path of light and the path of darkness is one in the same. 04:19, August 7, 2013 (UTC)

I could see Tragoedia at 3, but it might be too good at 3. Burial from a D.D. was abused when it was at 3, since it's a chainable quick-spell, and easy way to reuse banished monsters, but it hasn't seen much play as of late, so it wouldn't surprise me. I don't think EEV will be hit, since not every deck can drop a 2500+ beater in one turn; crazy box became a good one for rank 4 swarm decks but it doesn't make EEV banworthy, maybe it could get limited or semi'd but banning EEV is too harsh. I'd like to see the big guys get hit over the minis, but that's just me. With the new Zombie support in Shadow Specters, I could see Mezuki at 2, not sure about Plaguespreader though. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 13:15, August 7, 2013 (UTC)

Yeah EEV I think is a hit or miss on my list. I would rather hit big dragons, but I don't think konami is going to do it this list. Trag at 3 could also be too much, but I'm not sure what would run 3 of him and make it too good. --Sometimes the path of light and the path of darkness is one in the same. 21:10, August 7, 2013 (UTC)

Well, here's what I want/think will happen in the upcoming banlist.

Forbidden

Pot of Avarice - Well, to promote the new card "Pot of Duplicity" this will probably get hit. Duplicity is a less broken version of Avarice.

Mind Control - This card just goes into too many synchros and xyz. It just keeps getting better as time goes on.

Number 11: Big Eye - Well, it isn't too likely, but there isn't any point in limiting it. Goyo banned and not this card annoys me a lot.

Limited

Super Rejuvenation - This card speaks for itself in Dragon Rulers. I wouldn't be surprised if it got banned too.

Evilswarm Ophion - I really do not know what Konami is going to do with this card. They want to promote synchros in JOTL, and there is no point in limiting it. Perhaps limiting rabbit and this card will help.

Rescue Rabbit - Been out for too long. Is going to be splashable in more decks later. See above for Ophion.

Spellbook of judgment - Limiting this card will help balance prophecies, as they have a lot of recycling power. It will slow the deck down, and hopefully make it less broken. This is all the deck needs atm.

Goyo Guardian - I hope this card comes back so much. It is nowhere near as good as Big Eye, and doesn't have any loops (as far as I'm aware of). There needs to be a generic level 6 synchro in today's meta(other than gaia, coz I think he's bad.).

Tidal, and tempest - These cards are far too splashable, but I don't thin konami will limit this far. As they are coming out in the tins, they may only get semi-ed.

Semi-Limited

Legendary Six Samurai - Shi En - It is time for some older decks to resurface. If this guy gets solemned = gg. If he gets puppeted = gg. Six Samurai cannot compete with the likes of dragon rulers an evilswarm nowadays.

Blackwing - Gale the Whirlwind - Anti-meta is not doing anything, Blackwings need the support.

Inzektor hornet - This deck is screwed by the likes of kycoo and macro. They probably need another hornet to keep them playable.

Gladiator Beast Bestiari - Same reason as Hornet, if gets bottomlessed, gg. Is fine at two. Mezuki - Probably a good choice for Konami, to promote new zombies

Solemn Warning - Now here;s where it gets interesting. With the likes of dragon rulers, gorz and ophion destroying decks, this card probably needs to be at two. its either this or bottomless unlimited, but that would be too repetitive.

Unlimited

Magical stone excavation - Who runs this again? And if they do, what is it going to do to Dragons? jack****.

Advanced Ritual Art - See above.

Tsukuyomi - Might as well, its coming down anyway.

Black Whirlwind - Blackwings need the support. Three on the field is a little broken, but who cares, thats never going to happen, with all the msts out nowadays.

Other notes

I don't think they will hit the actual Dragon rulers much, as they are coming out in the tins. There is no point in limiting xyz such as big eye and dracossack, as they can still be summoned directly from the extra deck, and the only difference is you cant go into another one. There is still plenty of choices you can go for. Ophion however, is a big problem, as Konami wants to make money out of the new synchros, and he is the main card in a tier 1.5 deck. I think limit him and rabbit and semi warning should do the trick, although, warning can be used on syncs as well. Tenki isn't going anywhere just yet, as there is still fire fist support and bujins coming out, so this will not get hit yet. Hope you guys like and feel free to comment.

Lord Shien (talk • contribs) 13:36, August 7, 2013 (UTC)

Goyo Guardian is too strong for a Level 6 with no restrictions, it's 2800 ATK is just too much for a Level 6. Not to mention it steals the opp. monster for another Synchro or Xyz Summon. Shi-En should stay at one, being able to make two a turn is just too much for slower decks, sure Dragon Rulers don't care, but other decks kinda do. Gladiator Beast Bestiari needs to stay at one, Gladiator Beast Gyzarus spam with Prisma is just too crazy, besides there are only a few permanent answers to Bestiari, and most of them are either limited or semi-limited. Also, you could just do 3 Thunder King Rai-Oh instead of 2 Warning. Anyway, I doubt both Gale and Whirlwind would both come down. It's probably going to be one or the other. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 14:00, August 7, 2013 (UTC)

Ophion will not be hit, Evilswarms are a slow-paced tier 1.5-2 deck and they're only as good as their matchup is. Fire Fists and Bujins will be big decks next format, and Evilswarms hardly stand a chance against either deck, especially Bujins. Limiting Rabbit to 1 would be the best thing to do if you wanted hit Evilswarms, limiting or banning Ophion would kill the deck. Six Samurais are a fairly solid deck, even with one Shi-en, but they probrably won't get a 2nd one because they can drop two Shi-en in a single turn, and getting over double Shi-en first turn is so hard, if not impossible, with some descent backrow like bth or the solemn brigade. Even rulers have a hard time when they drop one shi-en and set 3-4 backrow. There are a few cards that could come off the forbidden list this September, but Goyo is not one of them. It's way too strong for an easily splashable, easily summonable lv 6 synchro monster, and its effect is too good. I can agree with a 2nd warning, but bottomless is too irritating at 3. Sure it's easier to counter than warning but it's still too much of a problem if it stays unlimited. I could see Blackwings with an extra gale or Inzektors with an extra hornet, but konami won't be trying to promote either deck anytime soon, so it's not very likely; also Black Whirlwind, if it comes down, should be at 2 first, not 3. Since zombies are getting more support from Shadow Specters, I can agree with Mezuki coming down to 2. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 14:46, August 7, 2013 (UTC)

I've held off on my predictions this time because I was thinking something like this was going to happen. This is a translated quote that was put up on the Yugioh Edition Singapore FB page, along with the image to confirm it.

'Starting from end September, major changes are coming to [OCG] major tournaments--!?

[OCG] ultimate evolution!! Changes to deck building rules for a more enjoyable duel!

Forbidden and Restricted list for major tournament system changed.

Details to be released in October's edition of VJump!! (Typically released about 20+ September)'

With this in mind the only thing I can think is that they're going to alter the way in which we can build decks so it's more in line with other card games like Vanguard or Duel Masters. In that certain cards can't be used in a deck if certain other cards are in the deck. It's even more likely to be this as it mention that the forbidden system has been 'changed'. So it's more that likely that instead of just saying something like 'The Dragon Rulers are now semi'd' it'll be 'The Dragon Rulers can't be used with each other in a deck.'

Anyway that's my update on that side of things. For my more standard list here we go!

BANNED Mind Control - This is a card which tilts over the edge of the forbidden list so many times. It's because of this that it's chance of being banned is just as much as it not being banned.

Spellbook of Secrets or Spellbook Magician of Prophecy- Yeah I know this is a harsh one but Konami have now sold all the cards they want to from them, which means that they'll want to kill the deck for a format or two. Don't believe me? Then tell me seen any Wind Up decks recently? Of course we may see a lesser hit but either way either one or both of these cards is getting limited or banned.

Pot of Avarice - Another 'may or may not' card. It all depends on if Konami is really wanting Pot of Duplicity to replace Avarice.

Super Rejuvenation - It all depends on if what the deck building change is. If it isn't what I think then this is clearly gone.

LIMITED Spellbook of Judgment - As I said, they're going to kill Prophecy one way or another.

Atlantean Dragoons - Should have been hit back in March but the deck was still to new to hit back then. It isn't anymore.

Sangan - Currently two cards show him boarding the bus to the forbidden realms, and not only is one named 'mistake' but he looks terrified in the other. Either this means that Sangan is gone for good as he's now boarded the bus there, or it means that he got on there by accident and he'll be back in the game next ban list.

Future Fusion - This will only come back if the deck building rule changes. So that you can't run Five Headed if you run Future Fusion. It's still quite a broken card but was put on there only to stop Chaos Dragons insta-wins. Then again I must admit I'm slightly biased towards this as I want my Worm Zero to be summonable again :P

SEMI-LIMITED Fire Formation - Tenki - It deserves a stronger hit but won't be getting it. I foresee it being semi'd but nothing more, if it gets hit at all.

Wind-Up Magician - With Wind-Ups all but dead Magician will go down to semi'd, if he isn't just taken fully off the list.

UNLIMITED Tsukuyomi - Since it's return it's done nothing at all to alter the meta game and doesn't see play. So it coming off the list is a no brainer.

And that's it! Yes I've done no mention of Draccosac, Big Eye or the Dragon Rulers but again that's down to how impossible it is to guess just what exactly they're now planning to do. They will be hit but considering they still have tins they want to sell, I wouldn't bet on a full hit to them until March.--The FireFALL (talk • contribs) 17:47, August 7, 2013 (UTC)

Yeah, you're kinda biased on Future Fusion. In reality, FF is probrably never going to come back so long as some dragon-type power creep deck exists (Chaos Dragons, Dragunities, and Hieratics also being things, aside from the obvious abuse rulers would have from it). Konami will not undo a banned change just one format after they did it; Spore was the only rescent exception of Konami undoing a banned change just one format later. Sangan has a chance to come back in the future but I highly doubt it'll happen this September since Konami almost never undoes a banned change just one format later. Wind-Up Magician won't come down, Wind-Ups are still a fairly powerful deck if played correctly. Magician (or Carrier Zenmaity) could come down when Wind-Ups aren't doing much anymore many formats from now, but they're still a fairly solid deck this format, and Wind-Ups only need 2 Magicians to top tournaments, as shown in the YCS's of the September 2012 format. I could see Konami just banning Spellbook of Judgment and calling it a day with prophecies, since without that they won't have any mass searcher to keep them tier 1. Tenki has a possibility to go semi, unless Konami wants $$ from Bujin; if that's the case, they'll leave it untouched until March 2014. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 19:03, August 7, 2013 (UTC)

Sangan's return all rests on what Konami means by Mistake, was it a mistake that he was put on the list? Or even with this mistake does this mean that he's not coming back ever?--The FireFALL (talk • contribs) 20:33, August 7, 2013 (UTC)

I think Sangan could come back next year or at some other point in the future, but Sangan is probably not coming back just one list after he was banned. It did happen before back in 2004, and with Spore, but this time I think Sangan is banned for good. It adds too much consistency to too many decks and it was the main reason tour guide was a staple alongside him. He can search Rescue Rabbit, Wind-Up Magician, Shark, Rat, Rabbit, and Warrior, Inzektor Dragonfly, Hornet, and Ladybug, Veiler, Maxx "C", Droll & Lock Bird, Ryko, Lumina, Kageki, Kagemusha, Maiden with blue eyes, Jowgen...Almost every single deck I know can use Sangan in some way, shape, or form and also call it a reliable card. And by March 2013 it got to the point where Konami said "that's enough", and took him away for good. I miss Sangan, but he probably won't be returning anytime soon. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 21:53, August 7, 2013 (UTC)

Organization Post

See this. It explains why fake lists are fake lists, but it's nothing we didn't already kinda know. The big thing is that the deck construction rules are expected to come with the list. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 21:56, August 10, 2013 (UTC)

I've seen lots of fake lists lately; most of those shouldn't surprise me either. The real list will probrably be leaked sometime late next week on Shriek. Mermails, Rulers, and Prophecies are all bound to get hit hard on the list. I also expect 1 or 2 cards to come off the forbidden list, but I'm not sure which ones. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 00:41, August 11, 2013 (UTC)

The Organization's site is one of this wiki's affiliates, and they said they would have it before Shriek, but who knows? --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 01:08, August 11, 2013 (UTC)

There's also a possibility the list could be leaked at worlds sometime later today or tomorrow, like it was at September last year. I can hardly wait. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 01:24, August 11, 2013 (UTC)

That's true, but Konami might try to keep it locked away for a bit longer. I hope there is a leak though. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 03:49, August 11, 2013 (UTC)

Supposed to be published on August 20 from Konami (Info from live stream announcer for worlds). But we should have something before then. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 17:21, August 11, 2013 (UTC)

And...Dragon Rulers win worlds. No surprise, they win just about everything. The banlist could be leaked anytime now up until the 20th. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 01:18, August 12, 2013 (UTC)

This Could Be It

Click Here.

The Organization claims that their man has potentially leaked the banlist. They also say that he's also been accurate...

Anyway, the list, if true, isn't that bad. There are a few questionable issues, but they make sense to some degree. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 13:54, August 12, 2013 (UTC)

It's probably fake. There are a few things that tip that off immediately. First off, the baby dragon rulers will not be banned, and if they, by some miracle, are banned, there's no point in hitting rejuvenation or big eye. And Konami still needs to sell their Dragon Ruler tins; no one would buy them if they kill a deck on it's first banlist. Abyssteus and Sphere aren't the problem; Dragoons is. Wind-Up Shark will not trade places with Magician. Gorz and Grand Mole to 2 is too silly. Trishula to 1? Really? No, Trish is not ever coming back it's way too powerful and splashable. Rooster just came out in the TCG in Judgment of the Light; it can't go to 1 that fast. Scapegoat is not coming down to 3, if anything it'll be tested at 2 first. Genex Ally Birdman AND Divine Wind of Mist Valley to 1? Does this list honestly think Harpie Dancer FTK is a threat? That list can't be real, not even half of that looks realistic. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 14:29, August 12, 2013 (UTC)

Some of it is questionable, but the Organization isn't claiming that's its all true. Although, parts of it might be. Mole could go to two, sure it's reusable, but it's not used in every deck. As for Gorz, it's basically a Tragoedia, they can both change the game as soon as they hit, but they can also be useless cards depending on where you are in the game. --Dark Ace SP(Talk) 14:37, August 12, 2013 (UTC)

Grand Mole is one of the most irritating cards in the game; most player's hate it when grand mole bounces their boss monster. It can also create a lock with Kaiser Colosseum. Gorz to 2 is a very slight maybe, but it's probrably better off at 1. There are a few things I can agree with in that list, a few being in the unlimited section, except for Scapegoat and Magician. Gale the Whirlwind is probrably coming down before Black Whirlwind does; searching multiple Kaluts on a single Shura or Bora summon is pretty busted. I could also see Bestiari at 2, but that's iffy. I agree with Judgment getting banned but Super Rejuvenation should be banned too. Most of the other things don't seem very realistic to me. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 14:48, August 12, 2013 (UTC)

Compulsory also bounces away boss monsters, just because a card is irritating doesn't mean it should be limited. As for the lock with Kaiser, it all depends on when you draw Colosseum and Mole, if the other guy gets set up, Colosseum and Mole don't really matter. Also...pick a side for Rejuv, a minute ago you were saying it shouldn't be touched. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 15:01, August 12, 2013 (UTC)

I was saying if that list is true, it doesn't make any sense whatsoever to hit rejuvenation or big eye if all of the baby dragon rulers get banned (which they shouldn't and probrably won't); banning rejuvenation and leaving everything else in rulers untouched is the better way to go for now. I'm not really a fan of grand mole, but then again, me and many other player's probably have butthurt over cards that otherwise don't appear that good, and Grand Mole is one of them. I, in all honesty, wouldn't be surprised if Grand Mole comes down, but I personally don't want it to happen. I've set up with Mole and Colosseum many times before, but then again that might have just been me getting lucky. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 15:21, August 12, 2013 (UTC)

Ahh, okay. If the list isn't real, I'd rather have some form of hit on the actual dragons, banning Rejuv doesn't do too much, it stops the free cards at the end of the turn, but it doesn't really solve any problem with making a lot of Rank 7 monsters and free Level 7 Rulers. Don't get me wrong, Rejuv is part of the problem, but it isn't the biggest beam in the building. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 15:45, August 12, 2013 (UTC)

Dark Ace, Super Rejuvenation is likely the key piece as to why rulers can top so much. If you take away Super Rejuvenation, Dragon Rulers would SUFFER from over-extending. I mean, when you look at them, after you discard 4 dragon rulers from two of the babies to summon 2 lv 7 rulers from your deck and then overlay for Dracossack, Big Eye, or Master of Blades or something like that, behind the two lv 7's summoned from the deck from the babies, they'd only have 2 cards left in their hand after that. And if you bottomless, torrential, ect the xyz they make, they're pretty much out of resources from over-extending. Super Rejuvenation replenishes all of their resources by letting them draw an entire new hand in the end phase. That's BS. Rewarding over-extension is the last thing a power creep deck like rulers need. If Rejuvenation gets banned, they'd have to use weaker, slower toolbox draw and search cards like Seven Star Sword or Gold Sarc, and at least Seven Star Sword says once per turn and uses up one of your lv 7 effects that turn, and Gold Sarc is a slow one for one card for rulers. I do believe the dragon rulers themselves will be hit, but since Konami still needs to sell their tins post-banlist, they probably won't hit the rulers themselves until March 2014, if they keep topping next format. Banning Rejuvenation will turn rulers into a deck like Hieratics, they'd still have some impressive power plays and possible OTK's, but if your opponent has an answer to your over-extension you're just flat out of resources. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 17:37, August 12, 2013 (UTC)

Rulers can simply just use the discarded Dragons next turn to do it again. Even if you respond to the first attempt, another one can easily be attempted next turn. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 18:51, August 12, 2013 (UTC)

They can use them again next turn, but at least they won't have an entire hand of dragon rulers drawn from Super Rejuvenation to back up what's in their grave already. They'd still be a fairly good deck without Super Rejuvenation, but at least they won't draw out half their deck in a single turn. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 19:02, August 12, 2013 (UTC)

The organization posted up an image, but it's not the best quality, but it's the best they could find. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 01:15, August 13, 2013 (UTC)

Still haven't seen any other leaks as of yet. I still definitely agree with parts of this list, but the list as a whole is definitely fake, the things that tip that off immediately are Genex Ally Birdman and Divine Wind of Mist Valley being limited to one. If Konami really wanted to hit the Harpie Dancer FTK, they would most likely limit Blaze Fenix, the Burning Bombardment Bird, and even that's not too likely, since Harpie FTK isn't that consistent nor problematic for the meta. The real list will be up on Shriek sometime in the next 3 or 4 days. We're bound to see many more leaks up until then. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 01:59, August 13, 2013 (UTC)

This list is awesome, and there's a scan of it. I'm guessing it's real. Xerdek!! (talk • contribs) 02:07, August 13, 2013 (UTC)

Most of it is mere speculation as of now, and I honestly hope at least some parts of this are real. Spellbook of Judgment should be banned, and I hope Rejuv goes to banned too. I hope Rooster doesn't be hit after only being legal for a week in the TCG. Like I mentioned earlier, I'd like to see Scapegoat semi-d first instead of go straight to 3, but I agree it should come down from 1. Wind-Ups don't have to be hit anymore, trading Shark for Magician isn't something realistic, and Konami probably won't do something like that after neutering the deck in March. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 02:13, August 13, 2013 (UTC)

Suddenly banning the little Elemental Dragons is pretty much like retconning their existence and saying, "whoops, this was a bad idea after all," considering that they turned up in OCG from promotional packs and only been around for just short of a whole format. --Gadjiltron (talk • contribs) 10:26, August 13, 2013 (UTC)

If the chibi-Dragons do get banned, Dragons obviously lose some ability to make consistent Rank 7 plays, and I think that's all we can really ask for. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 13:20, August 13, 2013 (UTC)

Banning all of the baby dragon rulers kills the deck. I don't ever recall Konami killing a deck on it's very first banlist. They might kill them in March but they're only going to slow down dragon rulers in September. Outright killing them would be illogical, especially knowing the tins are coming out at that same time. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 15:52, August 13, 2013 (UTC)

It kills Rulers as an independent deck, but it's still possible to use all the Rulers in a larger Disaster Dragon deck. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 18:02, August 13, 2013 (UTC)

I suppose so, but I don't think Konami will ban the minis or do something else like that until March. In this banlist, I hope at least Rejuvenation gets banned. If that doesn't do enough then they can semi all of the lv 7's in March. That's my opinion on what they should do. But we won't know for sure until the 15th-17th, when the list is leaked on Shriek. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 18:07, August 13, 2013 (UTC)

Honestly, I think that this list is something Konami would do, and that's not necessarily a bad thing at all. Xerdek!! (talk • contribs) 18:40, August 13, 2013 (UTC)

Konami probably will do a few of the things this list mentions, but they won't do exactly what this list says. Trust me, Konami will not limit Divine Wind of Mist Valley and Genex Ally Birdman. They also have no reason to have Wind-Up Shark and Magician trade places. Wind-Ups are fine with what they have. Scapegoat, if it comes down, will be tried at 2 first. I can agree with Judgment getting banned, but they won't hit all of those cards from rulers. Either ban the minis, ban rejuvenation, or semi the lv 7 rulers. Banning the minis and limiting Rejuvenation and Big Eye is just overkill. Rooster also won't be hit, it's been released to the TCG too rescently to be hit. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 19:08, August 13, 2013 (UTC)

I found yet another list here, although this list seems even less likely. I still don't buy any lists as of now anyways. Wait until it's up on Shriek. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 01:22, August 14, 2013 (UTC)

Remember the last time we had Malicious at 3? --Gadjiltron (talk • contribs) 07:25, August 14, 2013 (UTC)

Yeah Gadjiltron, last time Mali was at 3 was in the good (or not so good) ol' days of Tele-Dad. It was basically a Reborn Tengu you could activate from your grave whenever you wanted. I don't think it'll come down to 3, and I doubt that list is real either. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 09:12, August 14, 2013 (UTC)

There's been a V-Scan, still doubt it's the real list though. Shriek might have the real list tomorrow or Friday. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 00:44, August 15, 2013 (UTC)

A reasonable, realistic ban list prediction

I'm not saying this is the actual whole list, but

what could potentially make the list.

Forbidden: Spellbook of Judgment

Limited: Trishula, Dragon of the Ice Barrier Goyo Guardian Super Rejuvination Gold Sarcophagus Atlantean Dragoons Evilswarm Ophion Eradicator Epidemic Virus

Semi-Limited: Blaster, Tidal, Redox, and Tempest Mermail Abysslinde Mezuki Plaguespreader Zombie Monster Gate

Unlimited: Thunder King Rai-Oh Tsukuyomi Agent of Mystery - Earth T.G. Striker Destiny Hero - Malicious Reasoning Mirror Force

Unlimiting Striker and Earth might make T.G. Agents too good again. Striker should be tried at 2 first, if anything. D-Hero Malicious is probrably not coming down from 2 like Tengu, although Tele-Dad might be dead, there could be some other good plays with Mali that I'm not sure of yet, even more possible if Plaguespreader went to 2. Limiting Evilswarm Ophion kills evilswarms. They won't do that, especially knowing Evilswarms are having a tough time on a competitive level. EEV is a pretty powerful trap card, but it's not easy to meet it's activation requirements in any deck; the only decks that really use it are Rulers, Evilswarms, and Dark Worlds. Not sure about Trish or Goyo, they're pretty unbalanced and overpowering synchros; also if Konami brings them back they'll be hurting sales from Judgment of the Light. I do think synchros will make a comeback in September, but not quite to the extent you're predicting. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 18:24, August 12, 2013 (UTC)

Free Trish and Goyo! - 5 Reasons Why They Can Come Back

Trishula: 5) She's not overpowering anymore: While Trish's effect Is powerful, she's not overpowered compared to cards like Big Eye. She's used as a counter card to help eliminate problem cards. With no loops, Trishing first turn would be pointless. 4) She uses 3 monsters to make: On top of that, one of them needs to be a tuner, and sans veiler, there aren't any really universal tuners. Trish is even hard to make in decks that do use tuners, like Mermails. 3) She can be countered easily: Ophion, Veiler, Breakthrough Skill, Warning, Judgment, Chalice, Bottomless, Compulsory, Laggia, Dolkka, Abyssgaios, Bounzer, Roach, I could go on. 2) At the end of the day, she's a level 9 SYNCHRO: And especially requiring 2 non-tuners makes her even more difficult to summon. Not many people synchro summon as it is. 1) She was unfairly banned: I believe Konami didn't ban her for her effect, but because they wanted to promote Xyzs, so they did so by banning the most powerful synchro we had. Don't confuse powerful with broken. While her effect might seem daunting, she is not game-crippling, and didn't deserve to be banned. She was perfect at 1.

Goyo Guardian 5) He's a level 6 synchro: How many decks do you know that can make 6s easily? Mermails and Blackwings are the only ones I can think of. 4) The battle phase has more to dictate: Mirror Force is at 2, Forbidden Lance an Dress are running rampant, Compulse is ran at 3 in most decks that run traps, Fiendish Chain hurts ALOT, and cards like Zenmaines, Maestroke, and the like are really hard to kill by battle. 3) He not only requires successful summon, but also a successful attack: Unlike Big Eye that just needs to be summoned and not veilered/breakthrough'd, he also needs to successfully attack a monster, as well. On top of that, his effect is optional, so a card like Ryko can make him miss timing. 2) The monster comes back in defense mode: Because of this, the monster brought back not only cannot attack, but has the potential of dying before you can even use it. 1) If he steals an Xyz, they do NOT have materials: This should be self-explanatory, but unlike Big Eye, stealing an Xyz is pointless unless it has decent defense, you use it as a beatstick, or you can drop Gaia Charger on it.

I tried to flesh this out as much as I could. While both synchros are powerful, neither of them are overpowered, and compared to other cards, are fairly balanced.

Infernity decks can loop Trishula, Dragon of the Ice Barrier. She's also easily made in Agents, Frogs with Fishborg Launcher, Plant decks, Psychic decks, etc. Also, you can't really use the Counter Argument. What if I said that Delinquent Duo can come back because we have Solemn Judgment, Dark Bribe, Magic Jammer, Horus the Black Flame Dragon LV8, and Spell Canceller? What would you say then? Although, I do want her back at one, it's only because I'm slightly biased and want to mess around with Frogs.

As for Goyo...he's still easily made. Psychics, Plants, Zombies, Mermails/Atlanteans, X-Sabers, and a plethora of other decks can make him. As for the battle phase thing....we have 3 MST and 1 Heavy. Not to mention we have our own Lances/Dresses. As for Big Eye, he's not exactly the easiest kid on the block for most average decks to summon. But Goyo? He's an easily Synchro Summoned monster in many decks, and it doesn't matter whether or not you can use the stolen monster. That stolen monster is just as valuable as a defender. Also, he has the highest ATK for a Level 6 Synchro monster, a really solid 2800. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 21:40, August 12, 2013 (UTC)

Trishula can be looped with Infernities and other cards, and while I think Trishula could come back at some point, her current place on the banlist is definitely justified. It was not banned out of Konami being butthurt over synchros or trying to promote exceeds; Trishula is truly one of the most powerful synchros in the game, and most of the time when I've seen Trishula dropped it almost always ends in that player's victory or a significant advantage to that player. I mean, banishing a card from the opponent's hand, field, and grave without targeting is definitely broken, far more than just "good". I could see Trishula come back at some point, but I feel there are better things to unban first. As for Goyo, at the end of the day he might just seem like another giant beatstick like BLS, but Goyo is 1) much easier to summon, 2) far more splashable, and 3) it steals the monster, not gets rid of it. You don't even need a synchro-based deck to use Goyo; all you need is Plaguespreader (a universal tuner) + any lv 4 monster in your deck, and voila, you've got him. Like Trishula, I do see Goyo returning at SOME point in the future, but again there are probrably better things to bring back first. The most likely cards I've seen people talk about returning this upcoming banlist are Dark Magician of Chaos, Magician of Faith, Sinister Serpent, and maybe even Thousand-Eyes Restrict. But since Konami is trying to promote new synchros in Judgment of the Light, they won't unban older synchros since that would hurt their sales. They won't make much money off of these new synchros if people just brush the dust off of Trish and Goyo, if they do return. Oh, and one more thing -- While Trish and Goyo aren't as broken as some other cards, the solution to the currently broken decks is not to unban other broken cards to try to balance it out, but hit the currently broken decks to the level of other currently banned/limited cards. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 00:59, August 13, 2013 (UTC)

My predictions for the September banlist:

Forbidden:

Spellbook of Judgment: because instant +5's are so fair!!!

Super Rejuvenation: because +8's and +12's are so fair!!!

Limited:

Stream, Reactan, Burner, and/or Lightning Dragon Rulers: The problem with Dragon Rulers isn't their big dragons, it's their bratty kids going "DADDY DADDY THAT THING IS SCARY BEAT HIM UP DADDY WAAAAHHH!!!" THe baby dragons are the main reason the deck is so consistent.

Trishula, Dragon of the Ice Barrier OR Glow-Up Bulb: Konami is trying to breathe some new life into Synchros with JOTL, so bringing back one of these guys will definitely do the trick. The only reason I don't say both is because that's just begging for trouble.

Sinsister Serpent: It's just too slow nowadays. The only deck that can take the most advantage of it is Mermail, and they pretty much will always have something better to ditch for their effects anyways.

Deep Sea Diva: Far better effect than TGU. Ability to make Synchros AND Xyz, doesn't even negate the effect of whatever she summons?

Number 11: Big Eye: Completely unfair card. Essentially Snatch Steal, except you don't get your monster back when Big Eye is gone, and you don't gain 1000 LP each turn. It even has the added advantage of not having to draw it. At least you had to draw Snatch Steal first!

Semi-Limited:

Wind-Up Magician: Wind-Ups got hit way too hard this format. It's either this or bring Zenmaity back to Limted, and at least with Zenmaity banned, Wind-Ups still have to rely on Warrior/Soldier for their Shock Lock combo.

Solemn Warning: This card was just fine at 2, and it's a great way to respond to all the swarming that will take place in the upcoming format.

T.G. Striker: This card is no longer even slightly relevant to the meta. There's just no point in keeping it at 1.

Unlimited:

Tsukuyomi: Too slow to make a difference unless at 3.

Thunder King Rai-Oh: Semi-Limiting him was just retarded to begin with.

The Agent of Mystery - Earth: Trying to promote Synchros? Why not give Agents their Tuner back at 3? Having 3 Earth makes Angel of Zera a very attractive card.

This is just what I THINK will happen, not what I WANT to happen.

Wind-Up Menace (talk • contribs) 07:13, August 14, 2013 (UTC)

I agree with most of this, except for bringing Wind-Ups back and limiting Diva and Big Eye. I miss Wind-Ups, but Wind-Ups have had their day and they won't be brought back until they aren't a threat anymore. They're still a fairly solid deck even in this format, and once old scars die away they might be able to come down. Wind-Ups don't need more than 2 Magicians to top tournaments and Carrier still gives them instant access to Magician from their deck, which would be better off grinded out with Summoner Monk. Wind-Ups could be brought back next year, but Konami won't bring back a deck just one list after they neutered it. Also, Diva is not the main problem with Mermails, Dragoons is a bigger problem since it adds any sea-serpent from your deck to your hand and leads to all sorts of random OTK's in Mermail decks. Snatch Steal can't be compared to Big Eye. Once Mermails and Rulers get nerfed in September there's no reason to hit Big Eye by then, since Mermails and Rulers are the only 2 decks that can consistently summon it every turn. Also, it won't matter if you don't draw Snatch Steal; you can just use the unlimited Hidden Armory to search it from your deck or recycle it from your graveyard. And Snatch can be used in any deck, unlike Big Eye. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 09:31, August 14, 2013 (UTC)

I could totally see Wind-Ups getting a bit of a boost. After all, Konami did bump Earth back to 2 in September 2012 even though she was Limited in March 2012. They also brought Spore back the format right after they banned it. They seem to be doing pretty good about realizing when they overkill a deck. And like I said, at least if Magician comes to 2 then Wind-Up will still need to play Warrior (which it SUCKS to draw into Warrior). Wind-Ups never really did anything this past format except for when Nick Tomlin Top 4'd with them at a YCS, and he only made it that far because no one sided against it. It's the same reason Inzektors won YCS San Diego in September 2012. Plus, they released a whole new set less than a month before the new format, and it's a set in which there are 2 new decks that are huge threats if left unchecked: Archfiends and Bujins (I don't say Fire Fist because they were already relevant long before the release of JOTL). They may need to revive something from days past in order to keep them in check. I say Wind-Up over Inzektor simply because Wind-Up never took 1st, 2nd, 3rd, AND 4th place at Worlds. As for Mermails, I forgot to include Dragoons, but I did intend to do so. Sorry for the slip-up. I just think Diva will get hit as well because TGU got put to 2, and Diva is far better as far as her effect goes. She's really versatile in that she is a Tuner, she Special Summons a level 3 OR LOWER monster, and that monster still gets whatever effect (not really relevant because of the way Diva is normally used, but still a perk when in a pinch). And Big Eye is totally justified in getting limited. Anything that can play a Dragon Ruler at all can play Big Eye. Tempest Dragunity is a really good example considering Synchros are gonna be a big deal this upcoming format. I even toyed with a Tidal Ice Barrier deck that was wickedly fast and consistent thanks to Tidal. anything Fiery can play Blaster (Fire Kings, Fire Fist, etc.), and have you seen Dive Kick Plant decks? Not really relevant since their key card isn't out yet, but when it's released in Shadow Specters, Dive Kick plants play Redox, which also gives access to Big Eye. You're slightly incorrect in your statement that only two decks can play Big Eye. Tempest Dragunity will probably be a big deal in the upcoming format, and giving them access to multiple Big Eye doesn't exactly balance them out. They're already going to have a blast with Dracossack simply because he is a WIND monster. Wind-Up Menace (talk • contribs) 14:55, August 14, 2013 (UTC)

Even so, limiting Big Eye to 1 won't stop it very much, while many decks can splash Dragon Rulers, most other decks that CAN run rulers can't make 2 or 3 rank 7's a turn so consistently like pure dragon rulers can do, and you really only need 1 Big Eye to steal an opponent's monster. If you really wanted to hit Big Eye, ban it. Limiting it won't do much since you'll always have one anyways, and while they can sometimes answer your one Big Eye, they don't always have an answer to it, like not all people facing pure dragon rulers have an out to their first big eye. While reviving old decks might keep newer ones in check, keep in mind Konami is running a business, so they want to promote their newest cards. Bringing Wind-Ups back from the dead might help slow down archfiends and Bujins, but it also might make people not want to buy Archfiends and Bujins, and Konami doesn't like it when people stick to their old cards. Agents and Plants got more support later on, and what Konami did to Plants and T.G. Agents in March 2012 really was overkill. What Konami did to Wind-Ups in March 2013 was kinda what they did to Inzektors in September 2012, they were severely hurt, but still have some power plays and OTK's if used right, not to mention Wind-Ups aren't getting a ton of support anytime soon. (BTW, it was YCS Seattle in November 2012, not San Diego in September, that Inzektors topped). I guess that same logic applies to Dark Worlds and how they topped at Long Beach in early 2012, since no one was ready for them, they took the YCS by surprise. Diva might be a secondary Mermail problem, although Sphere and Dragoons are probrably the main ones to worry about. Diva can do some pretty nice plays for Mermails, but Dragoons is the OTK enabler, while Sphere triggers Linde. Even so, all of the variants of decks that can run dragon rulers are more balanced than pure dragon rulers since they can't flood their field as fast (I mainly say this due to being an Evilswarm player myself; I've played against the decks which the dragon rulers of their attributes support, and they concede to Ophion a lot easier than pure rulers do), but that could be another reason to bring Wind-Ups back, if Bujins and Fire Fists don't rape Evilswarms good enough with Yamato + Crane/Honest or Quilin and Bear, respectively. Big Eye could go to 1, but like I said, since you only need one to steal a monster, and you're not always going to have the resources for 2-3 rank 7's a turn in a non-pure dragon ruler deck, banning Big Eye is the only real solution to "stop it". Dracossack and Number 74 are pretty busted by themselves. However, Big Eye being banned would probrably be more random than likely and I personally am not looking forward to that. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 16:40, August 14, 2013 (UTC)

Psychid's Two Cents: Number 104

Most of you may call me crazy for this, but I think "Number 104: Masquerade" should be on the Lists (probably at Limited or Semi-Limited), because I think the effect where it sends the opponent's Deck's top card to the Graveyard without any cost seems unfair. But that's just me. --Yes, it's PSYCHID! ^{He talks! He does stuff!} 23:45, August 14, 2013 (UTC)

That's it? Have you considered the fact that Masquerade takes 3 Materials to Summon, and under several occasions, there're better 3-Material Rank 4's to bring out? --Gadjiltron (talk • contribs) 01:12, August 15, 2013 (UTC)

Goblin Zombie does the same thing. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 01:57, August 15, 2013 (UTC)

My Banlist Prediction

Forbidden

Black Luster Soldier - Envoy of the Beginning(wish)

Limited

Spellbook of Judgment

Super Rejuvenation

Mecha Phantom Beast Dracossack

Number 11: Big Eye

Sangan(wish)

The Agent of Mystery - Earth

Semi-Limited

Blaster, Dragon Ruler of Infernos

Tidal, Dragon Ruler of Waterfalls

Redox, Dragon Ruler of Boulders

Tempest, Dragon Ruler of Storms

T.G. Striker

Wall of Revealing Light

Unlimited

Thunder King Rai-Oh

Tsukuyomi

Hieratic Seal of Convocation(wish)

Mirror Force

I want BLS to be hit only because Chaos Sorcerer is at 1. For me BLS must always be at least 1 step more restricted than Chaos Sorcerer.

Spellbook of Judgment is what makes Prophecy a good deck. Epidemic Eradicator Virus already is a big check to the Prophecy strategy so Judgment only needs to be hit to 1.

In a similar fashion, Super Rejuvenation is part of what adds to Dragon Ruler’s consistency. Hitting it to 1 limits their consistency a lot and coincidentally would also diminish the 1 turn draw Blue-Eyes engine.

Dracossack and Big Eye are the main problems with Dragon Rulers, and even worse considering a lot of the big decks in contention right now can easily make Rank 7’s. Similar to Wind-Up Carrier Zenmaity, they should be limited first for a test run and then appropriately adjusted according to how next format plays out.

Sangan I just want to see back because it seems the only reason it was ever banned was due to its splashability with Tour Guide for easy Rank 3’s. I want it back for my Crashbug Deck because it fits perfectly and can grab any Crashbug, including Super Crashbug <3

The Agent of Mystery Earth I put on limited only because, as I know little about the two cards and the deck in question, people say TG Agent was OP because of TG Striker and Earth working together. On the subject of TG Striker, I never understood why it was ever limited at all. Its effect isn’t that great at all.

I put the big Dragon Rulers at 2 because that would take them down a notch without outright killing them. With the Dragon Ruler tins just around the corner, I doubt Konami wants to kill them just yet, and with them at 2 the babies would only be used at 1 each due to natural order of keeping consistent.

Wall of Revealing Light I brought down because it can be eliminated quite easily in this day and age and would provide a wall against the vigilant offenses of Dragon Rulers and the soon coming Ghosttrick.

Thunder King Rai-Oh I brought down because he stops adding cards to your hand which is great against Prophecy and Dragon Rulers, and he’s super compatible with Hunders, whom I expect to at least be tier 2 next format. On top of that, in the mirror match Rai-Oh would stop Thunder Sea Horse.

Tsukuyomi I brought down because they have seemed to gradually be bringing her down due to how well she is for aiding the take down of big cards nowadays.

I want Hieratic Seal of Convocation to be brought down because I need a consistent way of getting out my Hieratics in my Hieratic Dragon Ruler deck.

Mirror Force I unlimited because of having another defense against vigilant offenses of decks to come and decks in contention.

I also feel like Mermail should be limited on the list in some way, seeing as they went away because Dragon Rulers and Prophecy came along as better decks, rather than actually being taken down. Because of this I think that Mermails will make a comeback if Dragon Rulers and Prophecy are taken down. I just don’t know how to limit Mermails effectively.

Bentheechidna (talk • contribs) 20:22, August 15, 2013 (UTC)

Convocation to 3 isn't impossible to happen, but Hieratics are a solid deck and they don't need their 3rd archetype-exclusive ROTA. But then again, Six Sams got a 3rd Smoke Signal this format so I can't say for sure. If you semi-limit the big dragon rulers, Draco and Big Eye don't need to go to 1 since they'll only make them at a moderate pace that way, and not crazily and consistently every single turn. If Atlantean Dragoons goes to one, Mermails will be fine next format. Judgment and Rejuvenation might bet banned instead, but limiting is the next best thing. Mirror Force actually doesn't see much play anymore and even if it was unlimited, I doubt anyone would use 3 of them, so I can agree with that. Wall of Revealing Light is limited because it can OTK with Reversal Quiz or Hope for Escape (in Exodia decks), not to mention it creates irritating draws with Self-Destruct button. I guess that's why Konami is leaving it at 1. Tsukuyomi and T-King to 3 wouldn't do anything problematic. I miss Sangan myself, but I don't think Konami will unban him just one list after they banned him, and he might never come back since he'll only get better from here on out. :( I'd trade 0 BLS for 2 or 3 Chaos Sorcerer any day of the week, but Konami doesn't want to do it. :/ As for T.G. Agents, they were over-hit in March 2012 and bringing Striker back to 2 would make them ok. Earth doesn't need to trade places with Striker though. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 21:04, August 15, 2013 (UTC)

SHRIEK CONFIRMED

http://shriek.twoday.net/ --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 13:23, August 16, 2013 (UTC)

There were some more additions from the first Organization post, but most of it was spot-on. The big adds were Chaos Sorc to 2 and Tenki to 2. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 13:24, August 16, 2013 (UTC)

Also, it seems like in the OCG, the banlist will be updated 4 times a year, instead of the 2 they currently have. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 13:26, August 16, 2013 (UTC)

Well, the "Trishula" list is finally real, I guess. Here are my personal comments on the new banlist:

Banned:

• Burner, Dragon Ruler of Sparks, Stream, Dragon Ruler of Droplets, Reactan, Dragon Ruler of Pebbles, and Lightning, Dragon Ruler of Drafts - Kills rulers as a pure deck, but it still allows them to be splashable into their attribute-archetypes (which is what they were meant for). I can agree with this, after some deep thought.
• Spellbook of Judgment - THANK GOD.

Limited:

• Genex Ally Birdman - I don't know what to say about why this one got limited, Gallis FTK and Harpie FTK aren't even that consistent. Blaze Fenix to 1 or 0 would've been better to hit Harpie FTK than this or Divine WInd.
• Wind-Up Shark - Wind-Ups were fine with what they had this format. Switching Shark and Magician was...odd, but whatever.
• Mermail Abyssteus - Mermails needed a nerf, this is ok, if Dragoons to 1 isn't.
• Brotherhood of the Fire Fist - Rooster - I'm surprised Konami would hit this card after only being legal for a week in the TCG. Did they rape hard enough in the OCG to deserve this? I don't know.
• Number 11: Big Eye - Banning all the babies and limiting Teus and Sphere makes this card so much harder to make, what's the point of limiting it when you only need one? If Konami wants this hit, they'd be better off banning it instead.
• Trishula, Dragon of the Ice Barrier - I wanted something to come off the banned list in September, but I didn't exactly want this one. But now I can use Infernity Synchro again and be one happy camper. :D
• Super Rejuvenation - What's the point of limiting this if all of the babies are banned? It has no way to be abused now aside from Exodia OTK and maybe Hieratics.
• Divine Wind of Mist Valley - Another part of Harpie FTK, but again, the right move would've been to limit or ban Blaze Fenix and be done with it.
• Abyss-sphere - A secondary hit to Mermails, I can agree with this.

Semi-Limited:

• Chaos Sorcerer - Fine by me.
• Gladiator Beast Bestiari - Sure, Glads could use a little push.
• Gorz the Emissary of Darkness - Lovin' dem game changers. :D
• Neo-Spacian Grand Mole - Eh, why not, not many people use it anymore anyways.
• Fire Formation - Tenki - Secondary hit to Fire Fists, but it should've stayed unlimited this format for Bujins. To 1 in March.
• Black Whirlwind - I'd have prefered a 2nd Gale first, but at least Blackwings are coming back.

Unlimited:

• Wind-Up Magician - The ol' switcheroo, Konami style.
• Tsukuyomi - Idgaf.
• E - Emergency Call - Meh, HEROs don't need this and 3 Duality.
• Advanced Ritual Art - Why not, no one uses rituals anymore.
• Pot of Duality - I think this was fine at 2, but w/e.
• Scapegoat - Should've been tried at 2 first, might be too good at 3.
• Reasoning - No one uses it anyways.
• Mirror Force - Great game changer, but no one would run 3 anyways.

Those are my comments on the confirmed list. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 14:06, August 16, 2013 (UTC)

While losing 2 Rooster is painful and basically kills off 3-Axis, they still have plays in the form of Brotherhood of the Fire Fist - Spirit, Brotherhood of the Fire Fist - Panther, Brotherhood of the Fire Fist - Coyote, and Brotherhood of the Fire Fist - Kirin. While Coyote isn't really part of the suite, it might work with Rooster going to one. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 14:37, August 16, 2013 (UTC)

As for 3-Axis, it was fairly dominant in the OCG before Rulers and Judgment came into the picture. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 14:42, August 16, 2013 (UTC)

And thus, the voices of a thousand E-Dragon players cried out, only to be silenced swiftly. --Gadjiltron (talk • contribs) 15:29, August 16, 2013 (UTC)

Before Tachyon came into the OCG, Mermails and Evilswarms were also pretty good, but Fire Fists were good too, then again, Rooster to 1 just one week after it came into the TCG hurts a lot of Fire Fist players in the U.S. Now no one will buy JOTL for that. Trisula coming back will also hurt the synchro sales from JOTL, but Konami is releasing Trishy in the Tidal Tin, so ok. This format at least nerfs the dominant decks of March 2013, and while I will like the death of (pure) Dragon Rulers, Prophecy, Fire Fists and Mermails, I'm a bit confused at some of Konami's other choices. But, they probrably know what they are doing and what happened, happened. Next format, It'll be a bit difficult to tell what decks will be dominant. With a 2nd Black Whirlwind, Blackwings might be back, same goes for Glads with 2 Bestiari, and with 3 E-Call and Duality, HEROs could top as well. Trishula coming back could be revenge of the synchros, but I don't know for sure. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 16:02, August 16, 2013 (UTC)

I could never afford to build Dragon Rulers (Big Eye, y u so pricy!?), and now I have another reason not to. The good thing here is Trishula is back, baby!--Perfect Sige (talk • contribs) 16:04, August 16, 2013 (UTC)

This is going to be an interesting new format. I'll certainly be trying Wind-Ups again. :P Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 16:06, August 16, 2013 (UTC)

There's still a lot of reasons to buy JOTL. Even if some Fire Fist players lost Rooster, they'll still buy the pack, because their is another way for 3-Axis to live on. --Dark Ace SP (Talk) 16:18, August 16, 2013 (UTC)

Fire Fists aren't dead with 1 Rooster and 2 Tenki, but limiting Rooster just 1 week after it came out in the TCG will hurt JOTL sales nontheless. The list is somewhat random, somewhat realistic, but it's something I'd be fine testing out. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 18:22, August 16, 2013 (UTC)

It's worth noting that the rule change they talked about bringing in is not only a rule change but the entire restructuring of how Yugioh Tournaments are played in the OCG. Whether we see this change is up for debate but along with the changes to the tournaments they also announced that there will now be four bans lists a year. Starting with the next ban list in November. So don't get to adjusted to this list. Chances are it'll shift again very soon.--The FireFALL (talk • contribs) 23:02, August 16, 2013 (UTC)

Banlist time! ;)

Well, there are few cards that are certain to be banned, limited or semi-limited at least. I think that this banlist is going to hit mermails, evilswarms, dragon rulers, and maybe six sams?

Some of the cards that I'm sure about:

Spellbook of Judgment - Limited

Spellbook of Secrets - Semi-limited (maybe the magician too)

Dragon rulers - Semi-limited

Abyss Teus - Limited or maybe banned..

Abyss Megalso - Semi-Limited

Evilswarm Ophion - Limited, maybe banned..

Rescue rabbit - limited (definitely not getting banned because of some new decks that are using it as one of its ace monsters)

Well, Mermails are definitely getting hit. Not only that they special summon LV7 powerful monsters who recycle the deck but it has great combos with Tidal and Stream for more rank 7 xyzs. If they don't hit, they would pretty much act like new Dragon rulers since the big guys are LV7 and can bring all the mechas and big eyes. I say "new dragon rulers" since I'm pretty sure that those guys are getting limited.

Dragon rulers will also get hit.. I think that they will all be semi-limited. Maybe chibi ones are going to get limited to only one. Dragon rulers are going to tear apart and take place in other decks each. Redox in karakuris, plants. Blaster in Fire fists, Fire kings. Tidal in Mermails and Tempest will go into pretty much anything that has dragons and wind monsters (mechas, etc..) This will change the tier list.. Also think about the fact that Konami is probably going to make some new cards that these guys will support well..

Evilswarms.. Ophion is going to get limited, rabbit is also going to only "1" so most of players will take out helios.. Bahamut, which i think is the biggest problem, will not be touched.. If it does, then it would be banned because you don't really see xyz monsters that limited.. Also I think that they are going to remove some support for this deck to make it more balanced and "themed-like".

Prophecy.. Spellbook of judgment won't be banned, it will be limited, and however, you only need one because you can easily recycle it.. Maybe the spellbook of eternity will get banned to stop the "recycling judgment circle" as well as some others such as fate who can be semi-limited and secrets who is oftenly played 3 and is really after judgment the best card since it searches for a spellcaster, gets a spell, the spellcaster is, of course, magician who also searches for another one, "judgment" and so that card may get hit.

Fire fists.. They haven't showed really much so I don't think that any of them (even support cards) are going to get touched.. Fire fists will be there a little bit longer..

I think that, as much as I know that Six sams are limited (dead, according to some people) some of the six sam cards that are not limited are way to powerful.. I think that "double edged swords technique" that can special summon 2 sams from grave has to be banned.. Six sams players can synchro summon, sometimes even xyz for like monsters that require 2 detachments such as excalibur and then.. play this trap and do it over again.. when you want to attack them, they can just play this and make a barrier.. I don't really like that fact..

Heroes.. Heroes won't be touched as some people say that they are.. Heroes will maybe have their emergency go to "3" and maybe will go topping some events changing top tiers a little bit..

Battlin' boxers are briefly new and "not so meta" archtype so their yoke and all of them actually, are not going to get touched.. They will make some topping definitely..

Wind ups.. Shark is getting limited, as well as rabbit who is well used in many other decks.. Maybe they will get some of the new OCG cards soon..

Since some new synchros will be made, Konami will maybe, maybe, bring back Thrishula.. Brionac will always stay banned because it kills every xyz deck completely.. 90% new decks are xyz-based so Konami won't make that move..

All right.. That's what I think.. Share some thoughts on my opinion :)

Acomods (talk • contribs) 23:18, August 16, 2013 (UTC)

Acomods, Spellbook of Judgment and all the baby dragon rulers will be banned, the official list has already been confirmed on Shriek. Evilswarms were untouched, Shark and Magician traded places, Abyssteus and Sphere went to 1, and Rooster went to 1 and Tenki is at 2. You came a little late to make predictions...the official list is already confirmed. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 00:07, August 17, 2013 (UTC)

Well, I wasn't late because I didn't know the outcome.. I am the only one who knew his predictions right away :D Most of my predictions were actually right, I was right about shark, thrishula, big eye, mermails, partly of rulers and spellbooks.. So glad tenki is limited and that Black Whirlwind and Grand mole go to 2! Gorz doesn't make sense and having scapegoat at 3 was for syncs aldo id never put it in a synchro deck.. 3 Duality, for a special summoning deck, is too much.. Really glad what they did :D

Acomods (talk • contribs) 00:27, August 17, 2013 (UTC)

Time for my thoughts

Here are my thoughts on this new list:

Forbidden:

• Burner, Dragon Ruler of Sparks - Like all the other low Level Dragon Rulers, banning this straight away seems a bit extreme to me. I would personally rather have Limited either them or the big ones.
• Lightning, Dragon Ruler of Drafts - See above.
• Reactan, Dragon Ruler of Pebbles - See above.
• Stream, Dragon Ruler of Droplets - See above.
• Spellbook of Judgment - While this did need to be hit, I'd rather it had only been Limited (possibly only with Spellbook of Fate).

Limited:

• Brotherhood of the Fire Fist - Rooster - Eh, Fire Fists needed hitting. I guess this works.
• Genex Ally Birdman - I really don't see the need for this.
• Mermail Abyssteus - I'd much rather Mermail Abyssmegalo, or even better, Mermail Abysslinde, had been hit instead, but this'll do.
• Wind-Up Shark - I don't see how swapping Magician and Shark really changes things on the Wind-Up front. If I wanted to change things, I'd have said give them back Wind-Up Carrier Zenmaity.
• Trishula, Dragon of the Ice Barrier - I doubt this'll be as bad nowadays as it was during the Infernity/Frog format. This is fine.
• Number 11: Big Eye - With Dragon Rulers all but killed off as a deck, why was this necessary?
• Divine Wind of Mist Valley - No. Just no. Not only is the FTK not deserving of being hit, but Blaze Fenix, the Burning Bombardment Bird is far more deserving than this. It's like when they hit Evigishki Gustkraken over Constellar Ptolemy M7 (or alternatively, if they had banned Five-Headed Dragon instead of Future Fusion.
• Super Rejuvenation - See Big Eye.
• Abyss-sphere - Yep, this is a good hit to Mermails.

Semi-Limited:

• Chaos Sorcerer - It's ATK is too low for a boss monster. It's fine coming down.
• Gladiator Beast Bestiari - It'll be interesting to see how GBs fare with this, though I doubt they'll do as well as the inevitable hype with suggest.
• Gorz the Emissary of Darkness - Would you like to face 2 in a duel? Thought not. This thing seizes wins you have no right having.
• Neo-Spacian Grand Mole - This is still a great out to lots of things, but if we get another fast format, this is fine.
• Black Whirlwind - See my comment about Bestiari, but apply it to Blackwings rather than GBs.
• Fire Formation - Tenki - Fire Fists got their hit, alright.

Unlimited:

• Tsukuyomi - Ever since this became unforbidden, I've wanted to prove it shouldn't have been by remaking the old lock deck (using *Drastic Drop Off in place of Time Seal. Now that this is unlimited, I might just do that. The results of my experiments will give me the answer to whether or not this is the right call.
• Wind-Up Magician - Wind-Ups got a small boost gaining this in return for Shark, but it's unlikely to help them as much as some people will want.
• Advanced Ritual Art - This hasn't been relevant for ages. Why is it only coming back now?
• E - Emergency Call - This never really needed hitting in the first place.
• Pot of Duality - The hit to this was a mistake. I'm glad it's back.
• Reasoning - I still don't get how this is unlimited and Monster Gate isn't. Still, this shouldn't cause any problems.
• Scapegoat - Nobody needs a game with 2 more +3s. This is silly.
• Mirror Force - I guess only time will tell with this one.

So, in summary:

Agree with:

• Brotherhood of the Fire Fist - Rooster
• Trishula, Dragon of the Ice Barrier
• Abyss-sphere
• Chaos Sorcerer
• Fire Formation - Tenki
• Advanced Ritual Art
• Pot of Duality

Indifferent to:

• Burner, Dragon Ruler of Sparks
• Lightning, Dragon Ruler of Drafts
• Reactan, Dragon Ruler of Pebbles
• Stream, Dragon Ruler of Droplets
• Spellbook of Judgment
• Mermail Abyssteus
• Wind-Up Shark
• Gladiator Beast Bestiari
• Neo-Spacian Grand Mole
• Black Whirlwind
• Tsukuyomi
• Wind-Up Magcian
• E - Emergency Call
• Reasoning
• Mirror Force

Disagree with:

• Genex Ally Birdman
• Number 11: Big Eye
• Divine Wind of Mist Valley
• Super Rejuvenation
• Gorz the Emissary of Darkness
• Scapegoat

So what do you guys think? Battlemaniac (talk • contribs) 23:32, August 16, 2013 (UTC)

Considering that I never got all the right cards for the Dragon Rulers, the baby Dragon Rulers being banned means nothing to me. The only thing I was pleased about on this banlist is Trishula coming back, and nothing more. The rest...well, let's see how it works later.--Perfect Sige (talk • contribs) 23:45, August 16, 2013 (UTC)

If Konami is changing the banlist four times a year instead of twice, then I can't say I'll be accustomed to this list for long. Switching Shark and Magician actually gives Wind-Ups a powerful boost since you only need 1 Shark to pull of the Shark-Magician loop, but you needed more than 1 Magician to do it. Also, with Factory at 3 and Monk at 2 to easily search Shark, I'll be running Wind-Ups next format for sure. The Tsukuyomi lockdown will never be a problem so long as Time Seal stays banned, (Drastic) Drop off won't work as a substitute since discarding a drawn card could help your opponent (*cough* Darkworlds/Dragon Rulers), while Time Seal never will. Tsukuyomi could've gone to 3 a LONG time ago and I could've cared less. I don't think Scapegoat should've gone straight to 3, but it could've been tested at 2. Super Rejuvenation and Big Eye were also overkill hits, with all of the babies banned and Abyssteus + Sphere at 1, who's gonna make use of either card now? And yeah, Blaze Fenix, the Burning Bombardment Bird is the card that truly deserves the ban for Harpie FTK. Genex Ally Birdman and Divine Wind were unfairly punished. The only reason Monster Gate is still limited while Reasoning went to 3 is 1) Hieratic abuse with Gate, and 2) it must summon the monster it picks up, rather than Reasoning which is random. I'm not sure about Trishula returning, I suppose it could be tested in this format, but there are better cards to unban before Trish. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 00:00, August 17, 2013 (UTC)

my ban list predictions banned:

• all the little dragons- will slow the deck down, but will still keep the deck playable.
• spellbook of judgement- you plus way too much while also you get too add a spellcaster.

limited:

• torrential tribute- this card in ways is a lot better than mirror force and is increasingly getting a more annoying card to play against, it is a strategy breaker and is just bitchy.
• super reju- seriously konami just try it at one... if they dont ban the little dragons then ban this please.
• trishula- promoting synchros and the above ^
• big eye- nuff said...
• sangan- i think this guy has been treated unfairly by konami.
• birdman- it makes any synchro deck too good and most people only run one anyway.
• wind-up carrier zenmaity- i think if they made this back at one then wind-ups would have a chance in this format.
• abyssteus- this card is a ROTA for mermails and its a very XYZ compatible level.

semi-limited:

• tenki- slows down some of the better decks a bit, but not enough to bring then under a tier 2.
• t.g. striker- once again promoting synchros...
• lonefire blossom- i think we need to give a synchro format v2 a kick start...
• wind-up shark- only if they bring back zenmaity.
• gustkraken- hand loops are fun :3
• dragonfly- cos inzektors are amazing and this deck is not making big impacts at YCS now...

unlimited:

• convocation- hieratics need a boost, still being a higher tier deck.
• tengu- synchros again...

i think this is a pretty fair list for all decks, but comment if you think anything should change :) Azure-eyes white dragon (talk • contribs) 09:59, August 20, 2013 (UTC)

We have already confirmed the list for September. Scroll up a little, and find that you're about 50% accurate with your predicitions. Oh, and hand loops? Not as fun when you're on the receiving end. --Gadjiltron (talk • contribs) 11:30, August 20, 2013 (UTC)