Forum:Possible Sticky: First Draft

This is a first draft for a potential sticky thread as discussed in this other thread. Please do not alter this draft. Instead, post suggestions/comments either below or in the other thread. Lists are not complete, feel free to suggest additions. Also feel free to suggest additional information for any section. Thank you. Lappyzard (talk • contribs) 01:17, February 3, 2011 (UTC)

ATTENTION! PLEASE READ THIS SECTION FIRST (DON’T JUST TL;DR)

This page contains a list of many FAQ’s for rulings. Please do not edit this page; instead, post suggestions/comments/questions below, and don’t forget to sign your posts with four tildes (~). If a point made is unclear, you can ask about it below and I will do my best to clarify it.

Ctrl+F is your friend. Use it to search this page for the answer to your question(s).

Before starting a new thread, use the Forum Search function to make sure your question hasn’t already been asked and answered. Do NOT type in your whole question, as other people will most likely have phrased it differently. Search only for key terms, such as the card(s) in question. Additionally, you can add “Ruling Queries” (quotes included) to limit your search to only Ruling Query forums.

Before you make a new thread, PLEASE check the card’s Ruling Page. You can link to the page from the card’s article or go directly to it by searching for “Card Rulings:” followed by the name of the card without a space. For example, Card Rulings:Jinzo. Note that all of these rulings ARE official, as they are cited directly from judges or Konami’s website. If a ruling is uncited, you may start a new thread to confirm it, but please let us know that the ruling has no citation. As before, you can use Ctrl+F to search long rulings pages for your specific problem.

Other Pages to Reference

The Official Rule Book

Breakdown of the Battle Phase

Missing the Timing

Simultaneous Effects Go On Chain

Negating Summoning

Some Monster and Trap cards include the effect of negating Summons. There is often confusion among newer players about what summons can be negated. This section will explain the differences between the types of summoning and why some summons cannot be negated.

Common cards that negate Summons: Thunder King Rai-Oh, Royal Oppression, Solemn Judgment, Solemn Warning

Summons That Can Be Negated

Any Summon of a monster that does not start a Chain can be negated. This includes all Normal and Flip Summons, as well as 'Contact Fusions', Synchro Summons and Inherent Special Summons. Examples of Inherent Special Summons include Cyber Dragon and Machina Fortress. A monster that has its summon negated in this way is treated as not having been properly Summoned, and is also considered to have never hit the field. This means that effects such as Stardust Dragon and Jinzo are never applied. It also means that Semi-Nomi monsters can’t be resummoned through other effects.

Note: Semi-Nomi monsters, when first successfully summoned, can be resummoned through other effects such as Monster Reborn. Nomi monsters cannot. The two are distinguished within their respective phrases: "This card can only be Special Summoned by..." for Semi-Nomi and "This card cannot be Special Summoned except by..." for Nomi.

Summons That Cannot Be Negated

If a monster would be summoned through a resolving card effect such as Monster Reborn, then the Summon cannot be negated by cards like Thunder King Rai-Oh. This includes any type of Fusion Summon, because the Fusion Monster is Summoned by the effect of Polymerization (or similar). The Summon cannot be negated because the monster is Summoned at the effect’s resolution, and the timing is wrong. However, you can negate the effect that would Summon the monster, as well as activate effects that respond to Summons, such as Bottomless Trap Hole. If a monster is summoned during the Damage Step, such as Gorz the Emissary of Darkness, Tragoedia or monsters summoned by Searchers, then you cannot negate that summon, only the effect that would summon it, and only with a Counter Trap. Royal Oppression cannot be used during the Damage Step.

Targeting

For the sake of avoiding the word target, I shall refer to affected cards as "victims".

Another source of frequent confusion is Targeting. There is often debate on whether a card Targets or not.

Cards that are commonly debated as to Targeting: Fissure, Smashing Ground

Effects that Target

As a rule, Equip Cards Target, and Costs do not Target. Generally, if a card includes the term "select", "choose", "designate", "pick", or a similar term, it targets. This also usually applies to cards that designate "1 monster", but not always. For a counterexample, Smashing Ground affects one monster, but does not Target because its victim is chosen automatically. (This is still considered true even when you choose the victim in the event of a tie.) Counters themselves do not Target, but the effects that place them usually do, if you have to select a card to place them on. For example, A-Counters do not Target, but the effect of "A" Cell Breeding Device does. Traps affecting one monster, such as Trap Hole or Magic Cylinder, do Target, because they are activated when certain conditions are met, and Target their victim.

Effects that DO NOT TARGET

Cards affecting the Hand, Deck, or Extra Deck, such as Gigaplant (when summoning from the Hand), Reinforcement of the Army, or Success Probability 0% do not Target. Negation Effects, such as Tytannial, Princess of Camellias, or Solemn Judgment do not Target. Cards that have or can have multiple victims, such as Bottomless Trap Hole or Saber Slash, do not Target because their victims are chosen automatically (like with Smashing Ground) or at the effect's resolution. In the example of Saber Slash, the number of face-up X-Sabers may change between activation and resolution, so victims are selected at resolution. Cards that have other effects prior to a Targeting effect, like Magical Dimension, are not considered to Target at all. Cards that select monsters at resolution, like Creature Swap, do not Target. Monster effects that activate during Battle, such as D.D. Warrior Lady, Ally of Justice Catastor, Drillroid or Honest, do not Target. This is because they only affect monsters that fulfill the condition, which in these cases is battling. Cards like Ancient Fairy Dragon, although poorly worded, do not Target because Ancient Fairy Dragon will destroy all Field Spells (one active and one set), not just one.

When Targeting Cards are Chained To

If a card that Targets is chained to, and the result is that the Targeted monster is no longer eligible, the Targeting card resolves without effect. This often applies to monsters needing to be face-up. For example, if Brain Control targets a monster, and that monster is flipped face-down by Book of Moon, then it is no longer eligible (Brain Control requires the monster to be face-up) and Brain Control resolves without effect. The reason Smashing Ground does not Target is that if the original victim is flipped face-down, Smashing Ground will automatically redirect to a new monster, because its victim was never declared.

IMPORTANT NOTE: Cards such as Bottomless Trap Hole and Black Whirlwind that are based on ATK and DEF resolve without effect if the monster in question is flipped face-down, because face-down monsters are considered to have unknown ATK and DEF (even though the players know).

Destruction vs. Negation

This is perhaps the most common source of confusion among newer players. This section will discuss the difference between "negate" and "destroy", as well as clarify which cards are also negated when they are destroyed.

Destruction refers to destroying a card and moving it from the field to the Graveyard. This does not necessarily cancel the card’s effect. It does in some cases, but not others.

Any monster that states "while this card is face-up on the field" will have its effect canceled when it is destroyed. Any Equip, Field, or Continuous Spells (Spell Speed 1), along with Continuous Traps (Spell Speed 2) are negated when they are destroyed, because they are all treated as containing the phrase “while this card is face-up on the field”, The effect will be canceled if an effect is chained to its activation that would destroy the card.

Any monster that lacks this phrase, along with Normal, Quick-Play, and Ritual Spells, and Normal (Spell Speed 2) and Counter Traps (Spell Speed 3), are NOT canceled when they are destroyed. The effect is only canceled if an effect chains to it specifically states that it "negates" the effect.

One of the most common mistakes among newer players is the belief that Chaining Mystical Space Typhoon (Spell Speed 2) to any Spell or Trap card will negate the effect.

Sending vs. Destruction/Discarding

See also: The below section on Macro Cosmos/Dimensional Fissure

Another issue with destruction is that people often confuse sending cards to the Graveyard and destroying cards. If a card SENDS cards from the field to the Graveyard, it cannot be chained to by effects such as My Body as a Shield and Stardust Dragon, because it does not DESTROY them. Read the card(s) in question carefully to see if they destroy or send.

There is also a difference between sending cards from the Hand to the Graveyard and discarding. The difference lies in whether the effect can be fulfilled. If Macro Cosmos or Dimensional Fissure is active, you cannot activate effects that require you to SEND cards from your hand to the Graveyard, like Quickdraw Synchron. You can still activate effects that require you to discard, the discarded card will just be removed from play instead.

Commonly Asked About Cards

Jinzo

See also: Card Rulings:Jinzo, the above section on negating Summons, the below section on Skill Drain

Jinzo’s summon can be negated with a Counter Trap like Solemn Judgment or Forced Back, because it is considered to have never hit the field, so its effect is not yet applied.

If Jinzo is on the field, Skill Drain cannot be activated. Skill Drain cannot be activated in response to Jinzo’s summoning. Skill Drain can be chained to an effect that would summon Jinzo. If Skill Drain is active before Jinzo is summoned, Jinzo will not negate Traps.

Stardust Dragon

See also: Card Rulings:Stardust Dragon, The above section on negating Summons, The below section on Skill Drain

Stardust Dragon can be resummoned with an effect, including its own, ONLY if it was Successfully Synchro Summoned at least once.

If it was Special Summoned by Starlight Road, it cannot be resummoned by any effect as Starlight Road does not Synchro Summon the monster.

If it had its Synchro Summon negated, it cannot be resummoned by any effect.

Stardust Dragon cannot negate the effect of a card if it is unknown whether the card will destroy a monster or not. For example, Snipe Hunter may or may not destroy its target, so Stardust Dragon cannot negate it.

If Stardust Dragon would be destroyed during the End Phase, you can Tribute it for its effect and then resummon it during the same End Phase.

Divine Wrath

See also: Card Rulings:Divine Wrath, The above section on Negate vs. Destroy

Divine Wrath can still be used to negate an effect, even if it cannot destroy the monster. For example, Divine Wrath can be used against Red Nova Dragon.

Divine Wrath can negate an effect at any time from anywhere, including the Hand, Deck, Removed From Play Zone, and during the Damage Step.

Macro Cosmos/Dimensional Fissure

See also: Card Rulings:Macro Cosmos, Card Rulings:Dimensional Fissure, The above section on Sending vs. Destruction/Discarding

Any effect with a cost requiring sending cards to the Graveyard cannot be activated. Sending cards to the Graveyard is different from discarding. However, effects that send cards to the Graveyard at resolution, like Iron Chain Dragon, still work; the cards are instead removed form play.

If you have Gravekeeper's Servant active, your opponent cannot attack because sending a card to the Graveyard is a cost of attacking.

If Imperial Iron Wall is also active, cards are sent to the Graveyard.

Skill Drain/Forbidden Chalice

See also: Card Rulings:Skill Drain, Card Rulings:Forbidden Chalice

Skill Drain has no effect on monsters that Tribute themselves as a cost, because Skill Drain only negates the effect of the monster if the monster is still face-up on the field during resolution of the effect.

Gemini Monsters on the field are treated as Effect Monsters because their effect treating them as Normal Monsters is negated.

Monsters that would self-destruct, like Elemental Hero Captain Gold, do not self-destruct while Skill Drain is active. If Skill Drain is removed from the field, the monster will self-destruct.

If Jinzo is on the field, Skill Drain cannot be activated. Skill Drain cannot be activated in response to Jinzo’s summoning. Skill Drain can be chained to an effect that would summon Jinzo. If Skill Drain is active before Jinzo is summoned, Jinzo will not negate Traps.

Unlike Skill Drain, Forbidden Chalice can negate the effect of a monster that Tributes itself as a cost. This is because Forbidden Chalice negates effects that activate and resolve on the field, even if the monster is no longer face-up or on the field. For example, even if Exiled Force is in the Graveyard, its effect is considered to resolve on the field, so it is negated by Forbidden Chalice (but not Skill Drain).

Forbidden Chalice will not negate effects that activate and resolve in the Graveyard, like Sangan.

Forbidden Chalice cannot be chained to a monster effect where the monster is removed from the field as a cost, because it is no longer an eligible Target.

Suggestions/Comments

Feel free to change the formatting and whatnot. Adding to the part on targetting, and Fissure, Smashing Ground, etc.

As a general rule:

Equips: Target

Costs: Do not Target

Counters themselves do not target, but the Effect's of the cards do if you need to select which monster to put the counter on. (If needed, you can have this as an example.)

Effects that does things to the hand, Deck or Extra Deck do not target. Such as Gigaplant, Red-Eyes Darkness Metal Dragon, Star Blast, Charge of the Light Brigade, Foolish Burial, Skilled Dark Magician

Negation effects do not target. This includes Tytannial, Princess of Camellias, Stardust Dragon, Solemn Judgment, Prime Material Dragon

The traps which affect 1 monster targets. This includes Draining Shield, Sakuretsu Armor, Trap Hole, Magic Cylinder

Bottomless Trap Hole: Does not target. "Destroy and remove from play the monster(s)."

Necro Gardna: Does not Target. You don't really select the monster your opponent controls.

Cards which destroy 'up to' or 'equal to' a number of other cards do not target, as the cards to be destroyed are selected on resolution of the effect. This includes Saber Slash, Flip Flop Frog, Fortune Lady Wind

Cards like Neo-Spacian Grand Mole, Ally of Justice Catastor, D.D. Warrior Lady and Drillroid do not target.

Blackwing - Kalut the Moon Shadow and Honest do not target.

Magical Dimension: Whole effect does not target, including the destroy 1 monster part. "Tribute 1 monster and Special Summon 1 Spellcaster-Type monster from your hand. Then, you can destroy 1 monster on the field."

Patrician of Darkness: Although it says "selects the targets", the effect does not target. It's a continuous effect, not trigger, and you're selecting the attack target, not the target of an effect.

Inferno Reckless Summon: Does Not Target. You don't really select anything.

Ancient Fairy Dragon: The effect to destroy a Field Spell does not target. If there are 2 Field Spell Cards on the field (remember they can be set) the effect of "Ancient Fairy Dragon" will destroy both of them, so you don't choose anything. Yes, badly worded effect, I know, but that was from official rulings.

Creature Swap: Does not target. The monsters are selected during resolution of the effect. "Each player selects 1 monster they control..."

Future Visions: The first effect apparently targets. "When a monster is Normal Summoned, remove from play that monster."

The part after Magical Dimension can probably be excluded. Now to find my other lists... -Falzar FZ- (talk page|useful stuff) 01:55, February 3, 2011 (UTC)

Jinzo’s summon can be negated with a Counter Trap... needs an example e.g. (such as Solemn Judgment), also a part about Bottomless not being able to be used would be nice.

Macro Section needs what I said for Forum:Iron Chain Dragon and Macro Cosmos

Fixed error on Stardust

Fixed error on Skill Drain (If you use Lonefire Blossom's effect, it's effect activates on the field AND resolves on the field. The effect does NOT resolve in the graveyard, even if the card is in the graveyard.)

-Falzar FZ- (talk page|useful stuff) 02:33, February 3, 2011 (UTC)

as for target cards, this list always helps me: http://www.pojo.biz/board/showthread.php?t=848277 -dest- (talk • contribs) 11:42, February 3, 2011 (UTC)

another suggestion: There is quite often the confusion between sending cards to the grave and destroy cards, perhaps also include that. The same thing is for discarding cards and sending cards from the hand to the grave. -dest- (talk • contribs) 11:51, February 3, 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for your suggestions. As a first draft, this is obviously incomplete and needs expansion, so thank you. Lappyzard (talk • contribs) 20:22, February 3, 2011 (UTC)

what I've seen quite often lately:

When a card says "negate and destroy" it doesn't need to be able to destroy the card it negates in order to be activated. So, if you want to use Divine Wrath on monsters like Red Nova Dragon or a monster protected by Hardened Armed Dragon you can activate it, but it will just negate the 1 effect (not other effects the monster might have) this 1 time and the monster stays on the field.

Well, you could write that or another way if you have a better idea^^ -dest- (talk • contribs) 11:33, February 6, 2011 (UTC)

I'd use Divine Wrath on Stardust Dragon in the Example, since that's slightly more common. -Falzar FZ- (talk page|useful stuff) 11:41, February 6, 2011 (UTC)

Or I can make a section on Divine Wrath. Which I did. Lappyzard (talk • contribs) 00:03, February 7, 2011 (UTC)

I added a couple of links into the negatable summons section to make it easier for people to see which type of summon is being referred to, and some spacing into the above section about individual cards' cases. Jon Kovacs (talk • contribs) 00:16, February 7, 2011 (UTC)

This page could use a short section stating the differences between Nomi and Semi-Nomi monsters; that always trips up new-ish players. Jon Kovacs (talk • contribs) 00:20, February 7, 2011 (UTC)

another topic I just remembered and which is confused very often:

Why is Forbidden Chalice able to negate cards like Exiled Force while Skill drain can not?

(perhaps as a slight addition to Skill Drain) -dest- (talk • contribs) 00:31, February 7, 2011 (UTC)

about Nomi/semi-nomi: just compare the different texts:

Nomi - This card cannot be normal summoned or set. This card cannot be special summoned except by [...]

Semi-Nomi - This card cannot be normal summoned or set. This card can only be special summoned by [...]

-dest- (talk • contribs) 00:34, February 7, 2011 (UTC)

I'll add some of that stuff later, but for now whoever added Spell Speeds put Continuous Traps as Speed 1. Which is precisely why I asked people NOT TO EDIT THIS DRAFT, INSTEAD POSTING SUGGESTIONS BELOW. I don't want someone to add anything wrong in before it gets screened. Lappyzard (talk • contribs) 01:16, February 7, 2011 (UTC)

This? -Falzar FZ- (talk page|useful stuff) 02:24, February 7, 2011 (UTC)

Yes. I'm okay with fixing a typo, but I'd really appreciate people running any additions by me first. Lappyzard (talk • contribs) 02:34, February 7, 2011 (UTC)

Made Skill Drain section into Skill Drain/Forbidden Chalice. Added Nomi and Semi-Nomi to Negating Summons. Lappyzard (talk • contribs) 20:12, February 8, 2011 (UTC)

From Effects that Target - "Counters themselves do not Target, but the effects that place them do."

It's kinda incomplete. The effects don't always target, as I said in my earlier post. -Falzar FZ- (talk page|useful stuff) 12:09, February 10, 2011 (UTC)

Fixed. Lappyzard (talk • contribs) 20:01, February 10, 2011 (UTC)

Oh... I kinda forgot about this.... XP Well, I'll give it a day or 2, and if no one has anything else to add, I'll take the body of this page and request a sticky. Lappyzard (talk • contribs) 00:42, February 18, 2011 (UTC)